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Let's vote on Language

submitted by Porcelain_QuetzalTabby without Ears[M] from self.GCdebatesQT

Soo, we originally had a rule about slurs. These included TIM/TIF, tranny, Terf and other such terms. A few months ago CIS was added in what I considered an attack on QTs ability to express certain concepts easily. Looking through the current posts by GC I've noticed that the unabtiviated version of TIM has been used quite liberally.

While that is in clear violation of the rules I've not deleted any comments because it didn't target a single user but a general group. But I noticed that this would also apply to TERF which is a slur I wouldn't let fly.

So I'm gonna put this to a vote:

Should the rule regarding slurs only be enforced for personal attacks or do we enforce the rule for all users equally. Please consider the experience of new users of either faction before casting the vote.

Simply write "generally" or "personal attacks" in a top level comment. Any comment below that will be disregarded as a vote.

Thread will stay open till Monday around 0500 GMT

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[–]BiologyIsReal[M] 15 insightful - 2 fun15 insightful - 1 fun16 insightful - 2 fun -  (1 child)

Hey, u/Porcelain_Quetzal, good to see you want take a more active role here. At the same time, though, I question your decision of wanting to change the rules without consulting with the other mods first, especially given you've mostly absentee for months. If you've talked to us, you would have known that what you say about "cis" has not been happening at all. Given that u/grixit never updated the sidebar with the "new rules", it's not possible to enforce the rule of not using "cis". Indeed, QT users have kept using the word, both as a concept and a to refer to other users, and they have not been punished for it. Not a single time.

In other words, in practise the rules have no changed: we cannot "misgender" trans identified users, but they and other QT users can call us "cis" not matter how many times we say we are not "cis". And I still think this is not fair.

As for trans identified male or female, we need to be able to express our ideas, too, you know? The sidebar suggest natal male or female, but many users of either side were not satisfied with those terms: GC because the word natal is redundant, and QT because it still refers to sex just like trans identified male or female do.

[–]AlexisK 11 insightful - 1 fun11 insightful - 0 fun12 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

not matter how many times we say we are not "cis"

When word is created outsied of group, never used inside group and used to call that group against their will - almost always such word is a slur.

[–]peakingatthemomentTranssexual (natal male), HSTS[M] 7 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 0 fun8 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Hi u/Porcelain_Quetzal! In my view, u/BiologyIsReal has just been enforcing rules and doing it really wonderfully. :)

My 2 cents: I feel like using the words that make up TIM/TIF is not at all the same as using the slurs themselves. The reason GC changed from using MTT/FTT is because TIM/TIF sound like names (misgendering ones). If you write out the words, it isn’t the same. I don’t feel like spelling out TERF would be the same as saying the slur either.

I just worry you might be using your position here to advocate against things that bother you in particular and I feel like it’s super important we stay neutral. I don’t like “trans identified x” and I don’t feel like it describes me or how I think about transness, but that doesn’t mean that people who see it as an identity can’t have the words to express that.

[–]worried19 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Generally.

Although I think there's a difference between simply talking about terms and calling other people those terms.