all 14 comments

[–]HouseplantWomen who disagree with QT are a different sex 8 insightful - 1 fun8 insightful - 0 fun9 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Radical feminism and gender critical feminism exist outside of the American political dichotomy and so it’s weird to associate the two so much.

There is no American right wing in Australia.

I’d say it’s pretty weird to say that if a radfem speaks on the one platform that will allow her to speak, a republican one, she’s now right wing but whenever a TRA is outed as a pedo or rapist they are immediately disconnected from the platform and are to be spoken about as an individual with individually bad ideas.

Why is a woman speaking next to a shitty man grounds for her to be a bad woman but a bad man representing your interests is an individual not representative of the group?

[–]SnowAssMan 7 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 0 fun8 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

"Both parties" are conservative, & both are to blame for the latest development regarding RvW.

What are feminists supposed to do? Pretend Dems have their back? Make/vote for a third party that'll never make it, but even if it did, it'd just get infiltrated by the same corporate party that controls the two major parties?

Infiltrating the Conservative party is easier than trying to influence the "liberal" party. Boycotting the conservative party would be counter-productive.

[–]HouseplantWomen who disagree with QT are a different sex 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Radical feminism and gender critical feminism exist outside of the American political dichotomy and so it’s weird to associate the two so much.

There is no American right wing in Australia.

I’d say it’s pretty weird to say that if a radfem speaks on the one platform that will allow her to speak, a republican one, she’s now right wing but whenever a TRA is outed as a pedo or rapist they are immediately disconnected from the platform and are to be spoken about as an individual with individually bad ideas.

Why is a woman speaking next to a shitty man grounds for her to be a bad woman but a bad man representing your interests is an individual not representative of the group?

[–]BiologyIsReal 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I think it would be self-defeating for American feminists to limit their reach by not using conservative platforms. I mean, it's not like liberal media will suddenly allow any trans critical view. And they are going to be called conservative not matter what they do, anyway.

Then again, from my point of view, both conservativism and liberalism are right wing ideologies, and I don't trust liberal media anymore than I do conservative one. But for what I've seen many American women do care a lot about not being associated with conservatives. And in spite of how much they hate to be smeared as conservatives by TRAs, they don't have any problem in using the same tactics over anyone who criticizes US foreign policy. So...

[–]GenderbenderShe/her/hers 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Most GCs try not to associate with conservatives. In fact for most GCs, their only conservative beliefs are about trans people. However, many sites that don't allow right wing rhetoric also ban gender criticals views so GCs end up posting on Saidit or Odysee which of course don't censor right wing views but are one of the few places where GC views are welcome.

[–]Omina_SentenziosaSarcastic Ovalord 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

In an ideal World, we wouldn' t associate with either right wing or left wing since they' re both mysoginistic shits that hate women and they are both responsible fo the state of women' s rights, including abortion.

It doesn' t matter if we stop associating with conservatives anyway, we' re going to be called right wingers regardless of what we do and say. We were called that way before some of us started using conservative platforms, in fact part of the reason why some of us even started was that we were thrown out from "leftist" places and called nazi and alt-righters.

I don' t like associating with right wingers, but I don' t like associating with left wingers just as much nowadays.

On top of that, the USA are not the one and only country in existence: in other countries we are not having the same problems related to reproduction that Americans are having, so whatever issue you have with American GCers associating with conservatives, I don' t see how that should touch upon GCers from other places.

[–]strictly 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I sometimes find it funny when for example American liberals vilify conservatives in more liberal countries as these conservatives might be more liberal than the American liberals criticizing them, conservative is a relative term. I also see a difference between collaboration in single issues and putting a group into power. If I was a politician I would for example have no problem voting against males participating in female sports and “help” people I otherwise disagree with outvoting the other side in this single issue, but I wouldn’t put my vote on a party I overall disagree with just because I agree with them on some trans related issues.

[–]theory_of_thisan actual straight crossdresser 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (6 children)

Gender Critical feminists overlap with some social conservative thinking. But they also diverge.

A problem is social conservatives are a larger percentage of the population and gender critical radical feminists. So popular gender critical feminism gets overwhelmed by social conservatives who aren't interested in radical feminism.

Gender critical feminism has a relationship with masculinity that defines it's audience.

[–]peakingatthemomentTranssexual (natal male), HSTS 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (5 children)

Gender critical feminism has a relationship with masculinity that defines it's audience.

What do you mean by this? I do feel like many Rad Fems are super anti femininity and feel like it only exists to keep women oppressed.

[–]theory_of_thisan actual straight crossdresser 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (4 children)

Radial feminists often seek to reject femininity, I think they end up in masculinity, but then I think they are often drawn to masculinity. That's natural.

But the pattern appears of gc lesbians being attracted to expressing masculinity, not caring what men do as long as they stay away. GC gay males being attracted to masculine men, and not "pretending to be women." Straight GC are down for all of that, liberation for women and gender conformity for men.

The trans debate itself is gendered.

This creates a pattern in the sides.

[–]MarkTwainiac 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

LOL, this is like saying that all the people in the world fit in into one of two groups: red wine drinkers or white wine drinkers. When the reality is, a whole lot of people on earth don't drink wine at all. Plus, a good portion of the world's population at any given moment are too young to drink wine, even if they live in wine-appreciating cultures and will grow up later on to have a taste for it.

Just because you personally see the world through lenses that are hyper-focused on masculinity and femininity doesn't mean everyone else does. Please stop projecting your own views, preoccupations and hangups onto others - particularly women whose vantage point(s) and views are very different to yours. From your posting history, I have the impression you don't have a clue what radical feminists, a lot of other women and many "GC" men think.

[–]theory_of_thisan actual straight crossdresser 1 insightful - 2 fun1 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 2 fun -  (1 child)

Well I'm glad I can still entertain you.

Just because you personally see the world through lenses that are hyper-focused on masculinity and femininity doesn't mean everyone else does

Aren't we all hyper focused on gender here? Doesn't gender critical want to talk about masculinity and femininity?

From your posting history, I have the impression you don't have a clue what radical feminists, a lot of other women and many "GC" men think.

I've chatted with gc plenty times to know and respectfully report their opinions.

[–]MarkTwainiac 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Aren't we all hyper focused on gender here? Doesn't gender critical want to talk about masculinity and femininity?

No and no. People on the gender critical side are critical of gender, which we see as oppressive and limiting, and we are critical of gender ideology and genderism. Your side is the one that wants to talk about masculinity and femininity all the time, not us.

I personally find masculinity and femininity to be pretty boring - and being "hyper focused on gender" IMO leads to migraines, myopia and madness.

[–]adungitit 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Radial feminists often seek to reject femininity, I think they end up in masculinity, but then I think they are often drawn to masculinity.

Women who reject femininity are not masculine. They are neutral. The patriarchy has labelled anything neutral and normal as property of men, because women are seen as foreign subhumans. You have been explained this difference before many times, shut your mouth, and then merely returned later to parrot the exact same things as if you suffered brain damage and amnesia.