all 89 comments

[–]Camberian 77 insightful - 1 fun77 insightful - 0 fun78 insightful - 1 fun -  (6 children)

What the hell did she expect? Gay men want male bodies. Biologically male bodies which started out male straight from the get go. They do not want to have sex with women. She probably was even traumatic to a few of them who were too drunk or stoned to realise right away. And her friend is a douchebag. A sadistic one.

[–]denverkris 26 insightful - 1 fun26 insightful - 0 fun27 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

What the hell did she expect?

These ppl are so fucking delusional. They treated her the same way they would've treated any other female who showed up. Your "transphobia" is all in your head babe.

[–][deleted] 9 insightful - 2 fun9 insightful - 1 fun10 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

What’s in her head is exactly what’s wrong

[–]LoganBlade 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

how many of these can be changed with hormones and surgeries

[–]denverkris 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

the girl went to a party after what, 2 months on t? seems like she was being read as female, so in this case, not many. and no matter how many secondary sex characteristics she manages to change, she'll still be a female, and there will still be a high proportion of gay men who will want nothing to do with her. Because they're gay men, and she's a female. So, irrelevant.

[–]meranii 13 insightful - 1 fun13 insightful - 0 fun14 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

Yeah, I'm wondering if the male friend did it for a laugh, as in "yeah sure honey, you're sooooo male and they totally won't mind..." because she only ever talks about her transition and he's probably TIRED of it. Meanwhile he left her alone to get his d*ck sucked.

She's delusional, though, and I can't feel too bad for her because she's showing the same kind of blind entitlement and inability to deal with people's honest reaction to reality that TiMs have, only gay men generally don't feel threatened by women.

[–]weirdthorn[S] 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Unfortunately we only have her side, I would love to hear his side. It could have been her trying to insert herself and him having enough of trying to dissuade her and letting life give her a lesson or him just being a giant asshole.

[–]Barber_Acrobatic 54 insightful - 22 fun54 insightful - 21 fun55 insightful - 22 fun -  (1 child)

"Cis gay orgies are a very cis-centered space."

This has properly tickled me.

[–][deleted] 6 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 0 fun7 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

“Cis gay”. I can’t even wrap my head around these bizarre terms.

[–]RoundFork 61 insightful - 2 fun61 insightful - 1 fun62 insightful - 2 fun -  (15 children)

That was truly traumatic. I felt like she was filled with false promises then reality kicked her in the teeth.

If a woman wishes to transition to access sex, she should be slapped with that study where no one wants to date/sleep with a TiF (was on r/GC... dunno where it at...), so much work for so little reward. Just develop a more interesting personality jfc.

[–]IridescentAnaconda 64 insightful - 2 fun64 insightful - 1 fun65 insightful - 2 fun -  (2 children)

This might sound dismissive or cold, but she's probably better off in the long run. The last thing people need is to be having sex with multiple random strangers. Yeah, I'm judgmental about promiscuity, but it's based on lived experience.

[–]Gravyness 28 insightful - 1 fun28 insightful - 0 fun29 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I'm judgmental about promiscuity, but it's based on lived experience.

It is also a health issue, so you can say it's based on data too.

[–]ZeWombat 13 insightful - 1 fun13 insightful - 0 fun14 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

And she's better off sooner than later with the reality that actual gay men are not interested in a woman.

[–]just_lesbian_things 40 insightful - 1 fun40 insightful - 0 fun41 insightful - 1 fun -  (6 children)

I felt worse for the gay men, tbh. Maybe that's because I've been on the receiving end of this behavior from male trans people. Hets need to fuck off from homosexual spaces.

[–]Kelseyann93 19 insightful - 2 fun19 insightful - 1 fun20 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

Same, this is why I gave up lesbian apps. It's mostly men trying to score women.

[–]joeytundra 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

now if only heterosexual had the same luxury of telling homosexual men to fuck off from our spaces but when we do it it's "hate"...yet it doesn't stop gay men from using multiple platforms to seduce straight men into thinking about becoming gay and how transwomen are real women so no homo.

[–]just_lesbian_things 19 insightful - 2 fun19 insightful - 1 fun20 insightful - 2 fun -  (1 child)

They have as much of a luxury as the rest of us; so they can suck it up. Half the dating profiles I see are men or het couples despite me putting down women only. Het men don't deal with jack shit.

[–][deleted] 13 insightful - 1 fun13 insightful - 0 fun14 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Cheers to that. If I never get another disgusting het couple message it will be too soon. Maybe the people who treat lesbians like sex dolls can find out what it feels like when nasty people hit on them.

[–]msteacherlady 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Somebody's buying though, if the old casual encounters listings on craigslist were any evidence.

[–]msteacherlady 4 insightful - 3 fun4 insightful - 2 fun5 insightful - 3 fun -  (0 children)

I mean, I can't even imagine what it's like to be a gay man who enjoys going to orgies, yet I still have empathy for them in the situation. It's supposed to be a sexually charges male-only space, but then there's this boyish chick with her tits out walking around like one of the guys. It would be violating and kill the mood! I'm imagining the scene in my head and it really seems like a SNL skit.

[–]weirdthorn[S] 32 insightful - 1 fun32 insightful - 0 fun33 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

I felt like she was filled with false promises then reality kicked her in the teeth.

How does one get to that point, though? Was she never told "no" before? Usually one figures that stuff out in elementary school at latest. She seems to get social clues judging from the thread, so???

[–]a_blue_bird 29 insightful - 1 fun29 insightful - 0 fun30 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

How does one get to that point, though?

She probably spent her whole life on Tumblr and Twitter.

[–]msteacherlady 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Swapping yaoi stories where gay men had sparkles for penises and really big hands.

[–]3MistersAndAMissy 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Maybe it’s because as a woman, the one guarantee is that someone will sleep with you.

It’s why the TIMs feel so wronged when they transition and the sex they thought being a ‘woman’ would get them doesn’t come through.

[–]Lapis_Lazuli 9 insightful - 1 fun9 insightful - 0 fun10 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

It's not just that she wants sex—she wants gay sex as a gay man. That's the fetish. It's never going to happen, but she'll ruin her body and her life chasing the impossible fantasy.

[–][deleted] 55 insightful - 2 fun55 insightful - 1 fun56 insightful - 2 fun -  (5 children)

It was incredibly unrealistic to expect those men to sleep with her. I feel bad for her, but at the same time she needs help.

[–]MenAreFragileBabies 50 insightful - 2 fun50 insightful - 1 fun51 insightful - 2 fun -  (4 children)

I honestly am wondering if it makes sense to message this poor girl and try to talk some sense into her. She was talking about "ending it" as a result of this experience.

She's only two months in on T and no surgeries. She's only got a lot more of this kind of rejection ahead of her, and her life would be so much better with some therapy and just living like the straight girl she is. Maybe she just doesn't know you can live as a butchy, non-conforming straight woman?? She needs a real therapist to help her, or at least a real friend to tell her it's OK to just be who she is.

Should we use this space to try to help our sisters who are suffering in this way? I mean there's really nothing to stop us, since we've been kicked off reddit anyway.

[–]sudd3nclar1ty 39 insightful - 4 fun39 insightful - 3 fun40 insightful - 4 fun -  (2 children)

That thread was so cringe, poor thing. As a straight guy I was wondering how a young woman could be in such denial of others' needs and attractions. I can't imagine going to a lesbian bar and expect to be the Belle of the ball lol. Self-knowledge and accepting our limits are a hard road for all of us.

Your compassion and understanding are exemplary. Sign me up for the 'be yourself' team.

[–]denverkris 22 insightful - 2 fun22 insightful - 1 fun23 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

They surround themselves with other people who constantly "validate" them, to the point that they truly start believing their delusions. This woman sincerely believes she's a gay man, and anyone who wont play along with her delusion is obviously just a hateful bigot. She simply cant seem to understand why they dont share in her delusion the same way her "queer" group does. Its fecking sad.

[–]3MistersAndAMissy 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Go to a lesbian bar and declare yourself ‘Belle of the Ball’. Then harangue anyone who wont worship you as a ‘transphobic Cis-TERF’

It seems to work nowadays

[–]WrongToy 11 insightful - 1 fun11 insightful - 0 fun12 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Pfft that's like trying to convert someone who's very much into Scientology.

[–]Anandamide 50 insightful - 2 fun50 insightful - 1 fun51 insightful - 2 fun -  (10 children)

Personally I’ll wait until I’m post-Metoidioplasty in summer 2021 and then I’ll go to gay orgies.

Oh my god, the delusion and entitlement. NO amount of plastic surgery and unicorn dreams is going to make a gay orgy a place for you! This story is almost comically sad in the "wtf did you expect" realm, but the comments are fantastic. Reinforcing each others delusions that they "pass" (99% chance you absolutely don't) and that the problem isn't them, it's everyone else. Woof.

[–]WrongToy 27 insightful - 2 fun27 insightful - 1 fun28 insightful - 2 fun -  (1 child)

Does she even know what a metoidioplasty is?

Ligaments are cut so that the clit is maybe an inch long. It can't penetrate anything. Balls don't come with it.

She's interacting with people who want real peen and real balls. That's why they're gay.

If she wants to get her freakon, there's always Tinder and you know, disclosing beforehand.

[–]Anandamide 17 insightful - 1 fun17 insightful - 0 fun18 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

But they're so stealth, bro! Christ. It's like consent and boundaries are barely afterthoughts in pursuit of their own twisted validation.

[–]ImPiqued1111111 20 insightful - 3 fun20 insightful - 2 fun21 insightful - 3 fun -  (7 children)

Wowww...I just read that TIFs post. She claims to be a gay man, and said that if she went to a gay orgy looking for PIV sex, some men wouldn't be interested.


[–]Anandamide 25 insightful - 5 fun25 insightful - 4 fun26 insightful - 5 fun -  (6 children)

The delusion is real! On the Boxer Ceiling they have comments from TIFs saying that their collection of strapons is no different than penises, better even as they never go limp and can change sizes. And most are bottoms anyway! so to not see them as gay men is totally transphobic, dammit. It's like, have you ever actually seen or handled a real penis?! I swear these people have no actual sexual experience, just cyber and anime.

[–]ImPiqued1111111 22 insightful - 2 fun22 insightful - 1 fun23 insightful - 2 fun -  (1 child)

Exactly! I've seen this same argument lobbed at straight women (which I am one). It's, part of the enjoyment of PIV is the mutual pleasure aspect of it. That we're both feeling sensations at the same time from this one act. It's not close to the same thing as a man sticking a dildo in me. I can do that myself.

I don't know if I'm articulating this very well, hopefully you know what I mean.

[–]Anandamide 14 insightful - 1 fun14 insightful - 0 fun15 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Also a straight woman, and I know exactly what you mean.

[–]EnnuiOz 17 insightful - 1 fun17 insightful - 0 fun18 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I am not a gay man but I am close friends with a number of them. Apart from the obvious lack of 'equipment' on this woman, does she not understand that not all gay male sex involves penetration. They like dicks and all of the multiple sexual things you can do with them. A 'micropenis' (ie hormonally enlarged clitoris) or a strap on is not even in the ball park (excuse the pun).

Apologies to the gay males for not staying in my lane, but shit, really???? What was she thinking.....

[–]lmaonope333 7 insightful - 4 fun7 insightful - 3 fun8 insightful - 4 fun -  (2 children)

and TIMS call their flaccid dicks "organic strapons."

[–][deleted] 7 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 0 fun8 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

No one uses a soft dick, sorry tims. Lol.

[–]Anandamide 6 insightful - 2 fun6 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

Oh God, the nausea. Sex: you're doing it wrong

[–]fuckingsealions 44 insightful - 3 fun44 insightful - 2 fun45 insightful - 3 fun -  (0 children)

Hmm interesting. I see some the comments are telling OP that they shouldn't have gone "at this point in their transition process." I have never met/befriended a gay man who wasn't super all about that D, so I don't know what point in one's transition you should infiltrate gay male space.

Also, this post tugs at my heartstrings, tbh. Crying in the bathroom is never fun, but I hope this person LEARNS from that. If the situation was reversed, I'm sure a Tim would have done all that tone deaf overconfident male shit that lesbians just live to experience, lmao.

[–]NDG 36 insightful - 2 fun36 insightful - 1 fun37 insightful - 2 fun -  (6 children)

Honestly, I feel kind of bad for her. She’s delusional - yeah, gay guys are TOTALLY going to want to have sex with a vaguely masculine woman with breasts and a vagina 🙄 - but I feel bad anyway.

[–]RadioSilence 38 insightful - 2 fun38 insightful - 1 fun39 insightful - 2 fun -  (5 children)

Personally I don't, this is precisely the sort of entitlement lesbians see from TIM's. Gays and lesbians are not going to have sex with the opposite sex.

[–]NDG 20 insightful - 2 fun20 insightful - 1 fun21 insightful - 2 fun -  (4 children)

To me, it’s the Carrie-at-the-prom contrast of, “Come on, I know they’ll accept you!” and flat-out obvious rejection. She sounds more out of touch with reality than entitled.

[–]Feather 19 insightful - 1 fun19 insightful - 0 fun20 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

I think you're right. Even her gut was telling her not to go but her "friend" coaxed her into it by repeatedly insisting she'd fit in and people there would be attracted to her.

I think the friend is probably a bit of a sadist, but maybe this could be a wakeup call for her. Or maybe I'm just too much of an optimist.

[–]ImPiqued1111111 19 insightful - 2 fun19 insightful - 1 fun20 insightful - 2 fun -  (2 children)

I have some sympathy because I feel like TIFs tend to pass more than TIMs. So if she was clocked at this party before she undressed, she is really not passing at all. Her friend invited her, and when she wasn't sure, her friend insisted it would be fine and the party would be "inclusive". And then when it wasn't fine for her at all, he insisted she stay. This whole thing obviously really messed with her head, and her friend never should have put her in this position.

I tend to have a bit more sympathy for young TIFs, for all the reasons outlined by Shrier. They're a vulnerable group.

It was definitely inappropriate for her to be there, but I sort of feel like she was conned into it.

[–]Feather 27 insightful - 1 fun27 insightful - 0 fun28 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I agree.

I finished reading Shrier's book. It was so appalling. I had no idea how much trans stuff many kids are being fed even in elementary school or that so many colleges will prescribe testosterone at someone's first "therapy" appointment.

It caused me to ask my daughter if she'd been exposed to the stuff mentioned in the book and she told me she'd been exposed to ALL of it. She said that about a quarter of her girl friends had "come out" as trans at some point and then taken it back a few months later. I was relieved to discover she had a sane view of it though. We had a really good, nuanced discussion.

[–]Amareldys 10 insightful - 1 fun10 insightful - 0 fun11 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Yeah her friend is an asshole

[–]WrongToy 30 insightful - 2 fun30 insightful - 1 fun31 insightful - 2 fun -  (1 child)

Years back, I read on a gay male site how some guy was catfished in a gay bar totally drunk and hooked up with a TIF. They went to the men's to do the deed, he did the reach around and felt nothing so he flipped the partner over. As he put it, what he saw looked like a ball-less individual with a very small peen. He told her he didn't do women, she started crying and he left.

[–]Barber_Acrobatic 48 insightful - 1 fun48 insightful - 0 fun49 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

That definitely starts getting into the rape by deception territory. And by 'gets into' I'd say it was rapey as fuck regardless of the local laws. I cannot understand why anyone would want to have sex with anyone who they have to trick or hoodwink into it, whether malicious or born out of insecurity I don't care, it's repulsive.

[–]nrrw1996 30 insightful - 1 fun30 insightful - 0 fun31 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

Welcome to the real world, where people are not going to cater to your special feelings. This is what happens when you try to make the sexes identical instead of recognizing that there are real differences between the two.

[–]fuckupaddams 6 insightful - 4 fun6 insightful - 3 fun7 insightful - 4 fun -  (0 children)

A very brave and stunning take

[–][deleted] 30 insightful - 1 fun30 insightful - 0 fun31 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

It’s not a surprise that someone so dissociated from their own body doesn’t realize that other people experience sex and attraction completely differently than she does. I think that’s one of the big disconnections in many trans people’s ability to understand homosexuality. Because they don’t relate to their bodies, they don’t understand why bodies are a big deal to anyone else. Their desire is the only desire they have room for, it’s a one-way street that they assume everyone else is on. It’s such a mindfuck

[–][deleted] 11 insightful - 1 fun11 insightful - 0 fun12 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Oh, yes! Agree! After I read The Body Keeps the Score all this deluded behavior makes so much sense. So sad a lot of people are being further pushed to disengage from their bodies. :(

[–]Anandamide 7 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 0 fun8 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

This is a really good point IMO. A podcaster I follow has been flirting with coming out as trans, and recently spoke about how disconnected he is from his own sexuality. He said he doesn't really understand sexual attraction and desire. Obvs that's just one person, but it was a noted observation (and one that had little to do with the issue at hand, a pop song). It honestly made me feel bad for his wife, who he clearly cares for but more as a BFF than lover? IDK.

[–][deleted] 9 insightful - 1 fun9 insightful - 0 fun10 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

They also seem to have trouble reading other people’s emotions and realizing when they are being too intense or obsessive. Their sense of humour is often weird. It’s just a lot of weirdness and disconnection with themselves and other people. I think it might be related to autism, or trauma, or both. But they seem to experience sexuality in a very disembodied way that they assume is normal for all of us. It’s like being colourblind but not realising it

[–]Realwoman 24 insightful - 6 fun24 insightful - 5 fun25 insightful - 6 fun -  (10 children)

Yeah, she's a real man and went and cried in the bathroom for half an hour, which is very typical for men to do.

[–]WeaselUnderground 40 insightful - 2 fun40 insightful - 1 fun41 insightful - 2 fun -  (7 children)

This is an unfair criticism and reinforces stereotypes. Men can cry and honestly the world would be better if more men did go cry in the bathroom for half an hour when they're upset instead of fighting or getting wasted or whatever crappy coping skills society has approved for them. This person is not a "real man" (ie male) because they were born female, not because they're comfortable with crying. Conforming to stereotypical gender roles is not what makes you a real man/woman.

[–]Realwoman 19 insightful - 2 fun19 insightful - 1 fun20 insightful - 2 fun -  (2 children)

First of all, the irony of a woman claiming to be a man on the inside while engaging in stereotypically female behavior.

Second, women just cry more easily than men. Yes, I wish men were not ashamed to cry and express their feelings but even then, men still would cry less than women. Of course, a man who cries a lot is still a man and a woman who doesn't cry is a woman

[–]WeaselUnderground 12 insightful - 2 fun12 insightful - 1 fun13 insightful - 2 fun -  (1 child)

I understand what you meant, I just don't think it's particularly helpful to point that out. Generally, the GC argument is "just because you like dolls as a boy (or insert your own stereotypical gender behavior) doesn't mean you know what it feels like to be a girl." so when we say things like what you're saying it's kinda selectively applying the reverse logic only to the cases you want. We can't have it both ways. It's the kind of comment that makes people point to GC people and say, "they're biological essentialists!"

[–]Realwoman 9 insightful - 1 fun9 insightful - 0 fun10 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

You can acknowledge average differences between men and women without that meaning that someone that doesn't fit the average is the opposite sex. Like you can acknowledge that men are taller than women or that men are more aggressive than women. Tall, aggressive women are still women and short, timid men are still men.

[–]3MistersAndAMissy 4 insightful - 2 fun4 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

The irony is that we GCers disagree with gender roles/stereotypes making a person a Man/woman in favor of biology. She seems to want it both ways.


Sex, biology, and appearance don’t make me a man. I’m a man because I’feel’ like one on the inside.

Then I’m going to go and do a ‘stereotypical’ female action by being in touch with my emotions and crying in a bathroom.

She gets to disregard both biology AND gender stereotypes and everyone still has to say she is a man?


[–][deleted] 7 insightful - 6 fun7 insightful - 5 fun8 insightful - 6 fun -  (0 children)

I cried with a gay man in a bathroom for an hour when we were on mushrooms in 2003 and the bar was playing “beaches”

[–]OrneryStruggle 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

Honestly it totally is a thing that men do lmao.

[–]WeaselUnderground 25 insightful - 1 fun25 insightful - 0 fun26 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

I feel sorry for this person. Unlike the many cases we see where the person feels very entitled to a space and is angry that people don't want them there, this person mentioned in their post multiple times that they asked their friend if this would be an inclusive space for them and they were told yes multiple times. The post isn't saying that they should have been included so much as it is saying, "I felt humiliated and like my friend set me up for this and now I am emotionally wrecked and need to vent." I can only imagine how upsetting and humiliating this experience was for them. I think this is where the trans women/men ARE women/men rhetoric ends up hurting everyone involved, not the least of whom are the trans people who end up in a situation like this.

[–]PassionateIntensity 26 insightful - 2 fun26 insightful - 1 fun27 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

Yeah. I'm sympathetic on an individual level but-- the friend was her friend because he fed her lies to make her feel good, because she demands that of her friends. Society is coerced into gaslighting trans people while they gaslight us. It's a circle of madness.

[–][deleted] 21 insightful - 1 fun21 insightful - 0 fun22 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

2 months on T

I've seen a lot of TIFs that passed (to me) and are beautifully masculine, but they went into a community of men notorious for being blunt. They're gonna want what they want and 2 months of T and "gyno" (well, I guess they're not moobs in their case) just wasn't it. I feel bad that they had to suffer through the embarrassment, but jesus.

Edited for format*

[–]stitchedlamb 21 insightful - 1 fun21 insightful - 0 fun22 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

Sometimes I have to wonder if all these "trans masc" young women are turning to gay men because they seem to offer a safer version of masculinity. I know that's not a groundbreaking thought, but I've definitely been laughed at by other women for not being attracted to "masculine enough" type men (she laughed because at the time I was a personal trainer and the guy I fancied was pretty small, so apparently I was only allowed to be into gym rats I guess). Just like men are shamed for not being macho enough, women can get shit from other women for not being turned on by aggression and hyper dominance. But hey, if you're a gay man, you're allowed to date gentle/social/artistic men!

Whoops, there's that toxic gender role thing again.

[–]fireweed 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

It's just the desire to have sex with a man without the pain of being a woman in that arrangement. I would bet every single last "gay" TIF was sexually abused as a child. It must be a massive relief to think you can just turn into a man and have sex with men as a man. Of course, now they're all seeing the cold truth: gay men want actual men, not women with surgeries and testosterone injections.

[–]MarkTwainiac 21 insightful - 1 fun21 insightful - 0 fun22 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I quickly noticed that I wouldn’t fit in even though I sort of pass (FYI 2 months on T and pre top and pre bottom but I dress really masc and I have a smallish chest). The stares didn’t help...

It's really distressing how so many young TIFs - and TIMs - seem to have little or NO understanding of human sexuality and how it works. Abigail Shrier found in her research that most young females who go trans are doing so without ever having had a single romantic or sexual relationship IRL, not even a short-lived one.

[–]loona 17 insightful - 2 fun17 insightful - 1 fun18 insightful - 2 fun -  (1 child)

I sort of pass. 2 months on T. Pre-top. Pre-bottom.

Sis, no... This is what happens when you finally pull away from the internet and get a much-needed reality check.

[–]jelliknight 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I really feel bad for these girls. She's going to retreat right back onto tumblr, instead of looking around for a place where she DOES genuinely fit.

[–]ZeWombat 14 insightful - 1 fun14 insightful - 0 fun15 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

I'm going to go in a different direction- (although I agree with all the other comments) What if the gay men did accept her? What if they wanted to have anal sex with her? Get oral sex from her? But not in a sweet, romantic way- but more in that back-room-of-the-gay-bar type way. What would she have done then? Probably be just as upset, in a different way.

[–]msteacherlady 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I was wondering the same thing! My cousin confided in me some of the stuff he and his friends got up to back in their sexual awakening as young gay men and...yikes! I can't imagine any woman, T'd out or not, being able to hang with that scene.

[–]immersang 11 insightful - 1 fun11 insightful - 0 fun12 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

I know a lot of people here feel bad for her and it might be quite cold hearted not to, but I can't bring myself to have any sympathy. This is exactly the kind of story that needs to happen and especially needs to be told loudly on the internet. It's the only way to get people out of their delusional bubble at some point.

I've also read from people here (not necessarily this sub, might have been LGBdroptheT) who feel bad because they used to write slash fanfiction and now think that they are responsible for TIF delusions. And I think that's basically like feeling bad for selling wine because there are alcoholics in the world or chocolate because there are overweight people. I've read a lot of fanfiction when I was in college and I knew others who did and none of us ended up thinking we could be gay men in real life. It becomes obvious again and again that "trans" is at the end of the day mostly a symptom of other mental disorders. People who don't suffer from anything else will not suddenly become trans.

This woman needs therapy and a healthy dose of reality, not hormones, and certainly not people "validating" her.

[–][deleted] 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

I don't understand how you could go from enjoying sex scenes in fanfiction/books to wanting to be the opposite sex. And I read plenty of gay E-rated fanfics on archiveofourown. At worst it's a guilty pleasure, similar to shitposting on the internet and using cheat codes in games.

[–]immersang 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Exactly. Of course it's not reality, in fact I read it as a bit of an escape from reality. (Which is why I never cared for any fics with an unhappy ending; drama, okay, but please give me that happy end).

[–]Amareldys 10 insightful - 1 fun10 insightful - 0 fun11 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

You know, I'm going to blame the friend, not the girl. She thought it was a Queer event, when it was a Gay event. If he'd been upfront about what kind of event it was, she probably would not have gone.

[–]salty-tomorrow 8 insightful - 1 fun8 insightful - 0 fun9 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Then again I blame her naïveté for trusting some dude instead of listening to her gut.

It really struck me as the sort of situation only a young woman could find herself in—having a man pressure her to take her shirt off when she wasn’t fully comfortable with it, crying in the bathroom about it, idk...

[–]purrfect 8 insightful - 1 fun8 insightful - 0 fun9 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I'm all for entitled dimwits to face situations like this one. It builds character. The problem is this woman has bought a lie and she will need many more slaps in the face to realize she has wasted time, money and probably her health.

[–]Killer_Danish 7 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 0 fun8 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I feel like ending it all after that.

This girl needs therapy, not a bunch of gender-magic.

[–]lisasimpsonfan 7 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 0 fun8 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I can't believe she was surprised. Just because it's an orgy doesn't mean everyone or anyone will want to play with you. It was for men who like other men. Not men who like women dressing up as men. I do feel kinda bad for her because she will never be accepted into the community she wants to because women can't strong arm men like TIMs try to do to us.

[–]LoganBlade 6 insightful - 3 fun6 insightful - 2 fun7 insightful - 3 fun -  (0 children)

gay men like men


[–]ThisSiteIsUnusable 7 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 0 fun8 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I am frustrated as hell by straight TIFs, because they're- well. Like this. But I do also feel bad for them. TIMs who keep their cocks have some hope of finding men willing to sleep with them, if not date them. "Chicks with dicks" is a fetish for some number of men. It's not a large number, but they're out there. And the only partnered TIFs I know are lesbians who were with their partners when they transitioned. But straight TIFs just flat out don't have a market. Gay men don't want them because they're women. Straight men don't want them because they're masculinized. The extremely tiny share of people I can see maybe getting with them is bi men willing to pretend to see them as Valid Gay Men for the sake of easy sex. But even then, most bi men want standard men or women, not feminized men or masculinized women.

It is sad, because she clearly wants to feel "valid", possibly wants sex, and probably eventually will want a relationship but the farther down the path of transition she goes the harder it's going to be to find any of that.

[–]jelliknight 7 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 0 fun8 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

This is one of the biggest problems with 'transition'. It promises you that you'll feel more like yourself but encourages you to live a lie, so you feel MORE out of place, not right, not welcome etc. The solution? More hormones and surgery, obviously.