Doesn't "gender confirmation surgery" imply having a vagina confirms you're a woman?

submitted by odius from self.GenderCritical

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[–]Poppy29252 18 insightful - 3 fun18 insightful - 2 fun19 insightful - 3 fun -  (0 children)

In the same vein, I always wonder about if "woman" and "man" are defined as "someone who identifies as a woman/man," how do trans people know what physical characteristics to mimic?

[–]yousaythosethings 12 insightful - 1 fun12 insightful - 0 fun13 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Yes. They pretend sex isn't real, that you can't tell someone's sex, or what a woman looks like, but everything about the hallmark procedures shows it for the disingenuous farce it is. But hey it earns unscrupulous doctors, plastic surgeons, and pharmaceutical companies $$$, so shh.

[–][deleted] 6 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 0 fun7 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

There's a whole lot of doublethink in the trans community. If you feel an inverted penis will make you womanly, therefore you need the surgery. This comes with a free license to harass lesbians for not finding your butchered fake vagina attractive. But if you don't want the surgery, you are entitled to harass lesbians for not wanting "girldick".

Of course, trans people are not generally relationship material because people suffering from major unresolved identity issues generally will be a bit off-putting to healthy individuals...

[–]MarkTwainiac 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (7 children)

Doesn't "gender confirmation surgery" imply having a vagina confirms you're a woman?''

Huh? "Gender confirmation surgery" on male genitals might be based on the idea that "having a vagina confirms you're a woman." But in fact such surgery does not create a vagina or vulva - it simply reconfigures a male's testicles and penis so that they roughly resemble a vagina and vulva in appearance, sometimes with tissue from other parts of the male person's body.

The idea that vagina = woman is a flawed one that reflects a male POV and a total lack of understanding of how sex is defined and determined biologically.

[–]lefterfield 14 insightful - 1 fun14 insightful - 0 fun15 insightful - 1 fun -  (5 children)

That's the reality of the surgery, sure. But the ideological view is that these men are having the surgery to confirm the belief they have about themselves - that they "should" have a vagina. This is contradictory to the notion that a man or woman can have any sets of genitals, and it medicalizes what we are otherwise told is an absolute, unquestionable identity. Which is what I believe the OP is saying.

Basically, the ideology is contradictory on multiple levels and inconsistent within itself. They frequently say things that would be transphobic if anyone outside of their cult said them.

[–]MarkTwainiac 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (4 children)

Yeah, I wasn't really disagreeing, just amplifying the absurdity.

I should also have mentioned that "gender confirmation surgery" nowadays usually means surgery that does not involve the genitals. Such as facial feminization surgery, tracheal shaves and implantation of sacs of gel or fluid into the chests of TIMs, or double mastectomies, oophorectomies and hysterectomies in TIFs. Very few TIMs or TIFs get genital surgeries.

According to trans ideology, the notion that being female means having a vulva or vagina is way out of date!

[–]aloris342 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

Facial feminization surgeries do convince the public that there is a gradient from male to female. People are not aware that the person did not look feminine before the facial feminization surgery, so they think that these are people who are born with male reproductive organs but who naturally look feminine. That makes it much easier for them to believe that biological maleness and femaleness naturally occur along an intrinsic gradient. The practice of hiding a person's entire pre-transition history likely will contribute to reinforcing this perception. Expect this practice to become law: that it will be considered an act of harassment to disclose a transgender person's pre-transition gender.

[–]MarkTwainiac 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

Yes, I think the trend of males getting facial feminization surgeries is extremely concerning. And very bad for those of us who are female. It's also telling that the acronym for these brand new kids of procedures is FFS.

[–]lefterfield 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun -  (1 child)

Ugh, they keep changing the words and hiding behind euphemisms so that no one can challenge their bullshit.

[–]MarkTwainiac 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Some links to show how rare it is for TIMs in the US to get any kind of genital surgery.

Article published in the journal Translational Andrology and Urology in June 2019 said:

Genital GCS is generally less common than chest surgery, with prevalence rates of ... **5–10% for transgender women (7,9,32). For transgender women, genital GCS comprises a number of procedures, including vaginoplasty (most commonly intestinal or penile inversion) with labiaplasty and/or clitoroplasty, penectomy, and orchiectomy. Transgender women report bottom surgery at rates between 5–13% (7-9,32).

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6626314/

Report in the US journal Transgender Health in 2016 showed that only 4.7% of "transwomen" had undergone genital surgery. In this study, which relied not on what TIMs claimed/reported, but on the actual health status of persons examined and treated by medical professionals, only 11 of 234 TIMs had undergone genital surgery.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5012371/

A much higher percentage of TIMs will tell pollsters, online surveys and HCPs that they intend to get genital surgeries at some point down the line, but they rarely actually do so. Even males who are basically "professionally trans" and base their entire lives and livelihoods around claiming to be women, such as Gigi Gorgeous and Blaire White, usually end up deciding not to get genital surgeries. In fact, Gorgeous and White have made videos saying they see the results of such surgeries as repulsive in appearance, smell and function.

TIMS tend to be very much into their dicks, which is why they are trying to simply rebrand them by pushing for normalization and widespread acceptance of the ridiculous concept of "the female penis" and "girl dick."

Moreover, since these guys base their entire lives on lying, lots of TIMs have no qualms about claiming to have had genital surgery when they have not actually done so. Jenner, for example, told Diane Sawyer in a TV interview that he'd had genital surgery, whilst at the same time he shamed her as an impolite pervert for even wondering about it - and told her sternly that asking a "transwoman" about surgeries is disrespectful, ignorant and just not the done thing. But a couple of years later he revealed that he was lying to Sawyer when he claimed in another television appearance (during the roast of some celeb) that as a matter of fact he really didn't remove his dick and balls after all, he just "retired" them.

[–]aloris342 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I think also that this also speaks to the problematic idea that a vagina is nothing more than a hole in a woman's form. This is a way of looking at the female body that really centers the idea that women, as women, exist merely to serve men sexually. In reality, the vagina functions as a complex channel between the uterus and the outside world, with adaptive functions that protect the health of the woman and any babies she might gestate and deliver.

[–]censorshipment 2 insightful - 7 fun2 insightful - 6 fun3 insightful - 7 fun -  (0 children)

I thought that being transsexual is obsolete nowadays? I used to listen to gay males, who identify as trans women, explain why they can keep their dicks and still be women. Their ass holes are their pussies, aka "bussies" (boy pussies).

https://www.slanglang.net/bussy/

Men ignore TIM's dicks like men ignore women's clits during sex. Lol

[–]SharpTomorrow 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Don't bother, don't try to make sense of anything the gender ideologues tell you. Furthermore it changes by the minute. Now they are claiming that "TERF came up with 'Womxn' to exclude transgenders".