all 45 comments

[–]artemisiagrey 25 insightful - 1 fun25 insightful - 0 fun26 insightful - 1 fun -  (13 children)

I know the feeling you're talking about. For me it felt like an intense sadness and sudden "otherness". It would happen when a woman would ask me a typical question about any possible man in my life and I would not know how to describe the giant chasm in between what they assumed about my life vs the reality. Looking back at it, I think maybe I was also mourning the loss of ever having a "normal" life comparatively. I know I couldn't date guys, but I also didn't want to go through life not relating to other people.

I think this is why lesbian culture is so very important. It helps you not feel othered. It helps you realize how your experiences are not alone. It's okay not to relate. Reading and listening to lesbian media really helped me stay grounded in who I am when I felt out of place.

[–]Elvira95Viva la figa 14 insightful - 1 fun14 insightful - 0 fun15 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

"Reading and listening to lesbian media really helped me stay grounded in who I am when I felt out of place"

Lesbians related shit just makes me more depressed than anything. I don't have problem for being different, I've always felt differently because of my character, and lesbianism is just one more thing that makes me different. Being an extreme minority and the very small limited (especially geographycally) dating poll sadden me more than everything else.As anything else you cannot change, there is no point in constantly complain.

[–]artemisiagrey 14 insightful - 1 fun14 insightful - 0 fun15 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

I agree! There's nothing wrong with being different. That was just the process I went through to accept myself. We all process things in our own way.

[–]Elvira95Viva la figa 6 insightful - 4 fun6 insightful - 3 fun7 insightful - 4 fun -  (1 child)

Well, personally I thinki not being far from the norm makes your life much easier in many ways, but it isn't something we have control over. So I lind have acceptd it, despite not thinking is ideal.

[–]ZveroboyAlinaclownfish is a clown or a fish? || Febfem 10 insightful - 1 fun10 insightful - 0 fun11 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

That is exactly how conformism and oppresion works.

You are rewarded for being like people in power want you to be, and you are punished for being what you want yourself.

That is why so many lesbians (and female leaning bisexual girls) are transitioning early in life nowadays - they are love-bombed for "becoming a trans", for "being normal among woke", and they are hated and harassed for being lesbians and refusing to date men in dresses.

[–]oofreesouloo⚡super lesbian⚡[S] 14 insightful - 1 fun14 insightful - 0 fun15 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

I'm so so relieved that I'm not the only one feeling this. I feel so much better after reading your comment because you truly understand where I'm coming from and what I'm feeling, in particular:

For me it felt like an intense sadness and sudden "otherness". Looking back at it, I think maybe I was also mourning the loss of ever having a "normal" life comparatively.

This is exactly it. It's true that consuming lesbian media and seeing more visibility helps, it did help me a lot in the past in fact. Currently though, I just feel more depressed because I'm not "living it", if you know what I mean. But I truly appreciate your comment a lot, because you truly understand me. And it's still true everything you said.

[–]Elvira95Viva la figa 12 insightful - 2 fun12 insightful - 1 fun13 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

In the past it was useful. Fanfictions, series, I was obsessed as teen and helped me feeling normal and relate. It was also very exicting to see two women together as something how was not used to. Today is less of an interest. A good movie or story is always welcome, but media like site or forum really I don't like. I never liked a lot of so called lesbian culture.

[–]artemisiagrey 10 insightful - 1 fun10 insightful - 0 fun11 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

I'm glad! And acceptance really is a process. There is nothing wrong with how you are living it right now, even if it's not the ideal.

[–]oofreesouloo⚡super lesbian⚡[S] 8 insightful - 1 fun8 insightful - 0 fun9 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Thank you once again. You sound like such a caring person. I wish you the very best and that you'll be very happy in life.

[–]markiemarcus 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

"Looking back at it, I think maybe I was also mourning the loss of ever having a "normal" life comparatively."

Though I'm gay I can definitely relate to the inverse of this, certainly in my late teens / mid twenties and no doubt exacerbated by the loss of my partner at the time. Mid 30s now though and it's a very different story.

As for the OP and overcoming it? Time and embracing the fact that you are different; I don't know if any girl friend could really help you "get there". It's difficult to articulate, but my relationships with the women in my life are more akin to close family. I've not only accepted that, I love it and wouldn't change it.

Perhaps this is different for lesbians though?

[–]artemisiagrey 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I feel the same way now. I think the difference of realizing it's true and accepting it as your life can take time. And it hits different people in different ways.

From what I've seen, it takes lesbians longer to come out sometimes. For me I knew I liked women early on. Realizing I wasn't into men took longer. I've seen other lesbians say the same. I think that's where some of the cognitive dissonance can build up.

[–]reluctant_commenter 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

I know the feeling you're talking about. For me it felt like an intense sadness and sudden "otherness". It would happen when a woman would ask me a typical question about any possible man in my life and I would not know how to describe the giant chasm in between what they assumed about my life vs the reality.

I relate to this as well. Like a heart-dropping sensation. Like, oh, I forgot that most people think and assume this of me, and then I have to either correct it and risk an uncomfortable conversation or lie and feel bad about misrepresenting myself.

I think this is why lesbian culture is so very important.

Hah... I have had trouble finding it. Most self-described "lesbian culture" has been entirely colonized by identity tourists-- be it AGP male "transbians," or homophobic "political lesbians," none of whom are women exclusively attracted to women. This sub has been one of the better places for me for seeing normalization of my experience.

[–]artemisiagrey 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

Yeah, in-person culture is definitely hard to find. I mostly meant old poetry collections, books, autobiographies, recordings from concerts or women-centered events. Anything from before our current situation, when queer theory hadn't infiltrated our culture. Reading/listening to those things reminds me that we have always been here and always will be. It doesn't fix things, but it makes me feel better at the very least.

[–]reluctant_commenter 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Anything from before our current situation, when queer theory hadn't infiltrated our culture.

That's true! After reading this post the other day, I started listening to some older lesbian musicians, didn't realize there were so many. :)

Reading/listening to those things reminds me that we have always been here and always will be.

Yep. Exactly.

[–]yousaythosethingsFind and Replace "gatekeeping" with "having boundaries" 19 insightful - 1 fun19 insightful - 0 fun20 insightful - 1 fun -  (4 children)

I relate to almost everything you say. It's not the attraction to women that causes me stress and anxiety for the most part. When I'm with a woman, it feels very right and good, not wrong or shameful. The lack of attraction to men is the most alienating part. I do think a lot of bisexual women have a hard time understanding this being a huge difference felt by many lesbians, especially because I think it is the basis of the stigma against us, rather than our attraction to women.

I never felt that same-sex attraction was wrong. Since the moment I heard it was a thing (in the context of the gay marriage debate when I was in middle school), it made sense to me and I always supported same-sex rights. But I refused to see myself as one of them (. . . us). And it was because of my fear of being different. I never judged anyone else negatively for being gay, lesbian, or bi but I did not want to accept that my life would be harder in this way. I don't mind when my female friends talk about guys, but I can't say that I've been in a situation where I was with a group of women where they kept going on and on about men.

To be honest, I would feel weirder if women thought they couldn't or shouldn't talk about men around me or if people were tripping over themselves trying not to offend me. I really just want to be treated like any other woman. I understand that it's a lot harder when you're trying to hold it all in to not out yourself as a lesbian because you can't make light of the guy talk when I think humor is the best way to handle it around those who know you're gay.

All of this being said, I'm dealing with my own struggles and unprocessed issues that relate to my being gay that I may share in the near future on here. Life is definitely lonely right now and I feel alienated from "LGBTQ culture" or whatever that means.

[–]Elvira95Viva la figa 9 insightful - 1 fun9 insightful - 0 fun10 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

Yet lots of bisexuals seem to larp as lesbians and wanting to be lesbians at any cost. Kinda funny. By being bisexualss they get experience staying with women and also experience the privilege of heterosexuality. They ended up with men mostly because is so far easier to find a partner among men and also having a natural family with no stigma is simply easier.

[–]yousaythosethingsFind and Replace "gatekeeping" with "having boundaries" 12 insightful - 1 fun12 insightful - 0 fun13 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

I know you've been struggling lately because you feel constrained by your small dating pool as a lesbian. It's rough. It's a way in which the chips are stacked against us, and can make life very lonely. But I also don't mean for my statement to be one about relative privilege between bisexual and lesbian women. Just that it's a fundamental misunderstanding or blindspot a lot of bisexual women have. When I was trying to figure myself out and even afterward, I spent some time in bisexual spaces just listening to the discourse and whatnot, especially because a lot of it still felt relevant to be as someone who had come out while married to a man. I do think that this has given me some insight into both bisexual women and lesbians' blindspots with one another. Anyway, I did often see/hear expressed "What's the difference? We're both attracted to women!" and a general inability or unwillingness from those women to recognize a huge experiential difference between bisexual and lesbian women and that that difference might genuinely be meaningful to a lot of lesbians. I don't think it's necessarily malicious, just people not knowing what they don't know, having this validated by everyone all over the place, and viewing things solely from the perspective of their own self-interest. It's also quite fashionable and PC right now to rag on homosexual people as "gatekeepers."

[–]Elvira95Viva la figa 8 insightful - 2 fun8 insightful - 1 fun9 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

The privilege cannot be denied. It isn't so dramatic, I'm blessed with being seriosuly introverted, so being alone isn't a bad thing to me as for an extrovert, it doesn't make me miserable and desperate. I just sometimes think myself when my parents are dead me possibly alone, and undertsand I need to totally get used to rely to myself only. Homosexuality makes probability of staying alone in life or just for longer time high. It's the way of things. I just don't get people who see lesbianism as such cool thing, while is just something making life more complicated. You even have to think where to live based on potential bigness of dating poll. There is nothing super easy, even in this time and age where things are easier than ever, being a small minority, will always be harder.

[–]oofreesouloo⚡super lesbian⚡[S] 8 insightful - 1 fun8 insightful - 0 fun9 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Thank you so much! This phrases resonate a lot with what I'm feeling:

But I refused to see myself as one of them (. . . us). And it was because of my fear of being different. I never judged anyone else negatively for being gay, lesbian, or bi but I did not want to accept that my life would be harder in this way.

This was always one of my problems as well and it's one I apparently still do. I appreciate you talking about your own experience and totally encourage you to rant on here, if you feel like it. I truly love this community and feel safe and loved here and it always helps. I wish you the best!

[–]julesburm1891 17 insightful - 1 fun17 insightful - 0 fun18 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

Story time. I grew up lower middle-class. The summer we got to visit Massachusetts for a week is the biggest extravagance of my childhood. I got a bunch of academic scholarships to go to college, but a study abroad semester was financially out of the question. I’ve always really wanted to travel, but it’s just not been feasible yet.

Right before the pandemic, I was eating dinner with a bunch of friends who grew up better off. They were all casually talking about their trips to Germany, Japan, Costa Rica, and Ireland like it was no big deal and just expected. And I’m just sitting there quietly feeling worse and worse. On one hand, I have nothing to contribute to the conversation so I feel superfluous. On the other hand, even though I objectively understand there’s nothing wrong with being lower middle class or not being able to afford traveling, I feel like it’s my fault I haven’t done this thing everyone else seems to have done. It’s dumb, but I feel like I’m deficient in some way for not having the opportunity. So, I pretend everything is chill through dinner and then go home and sadly watch a bunch of travel videos of places I want to see.

That’s pretty much exactly what it’s like being a lesbian around straight women sometimes. You feel useless because you have nothing to contribute to the conversation and you feel like it’s your fault for not being “normal.” It just feels like a reminder that you’re different and makes you feel like you don’t belong. (The difference being that you can’t tell yourself someday it’ll be different.)

I’m not saying straight women shouldn’t be able to talk about men whenever they damn well please. They should. I think we should just also be able to have spaces for us homosexuals because being able to not feel different at least some of the time is actually really important.

Anyways, keep your chin up and don’t let the muggles get you down.

[–]oofreesouloo⚡super lesbian⚡[S] 7 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 0 fun8 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Wow, this was a really interesting comment! You described it perfectly well using a different example... This was a very wholesome comment, thank you! Big hugs and wish the life smiles at you and that you get to travel as much as you'd like! <3

[–]powpowpowpow 14 insightful - 1 fun14 insightful - 0 fun15 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

Hi, I'm not a lesbian but I remember being bullied by my young girl friends bc I didn't feel attracted to a boy that was very popular at the time, lol, so in a way I understand you being upset for the feeling of not being able to be attracted to something.

I'm sorry you are going through this and I don't have many advices since, as I said, what I went through, though slightly similar, it's far less serious. My advice at the moment is to perhaps find other friends that you can relate to better so you don't hyperfocus on the friend group you feel as though you don't fit in. I have some friends in my college that I feel like I'm a stranger, but that feeling dies down because I know I have another group of friends that actually know me and accept me and I can be myself and still belong, that comforts and makes you feel more in tune with yourself, so perhaps try broadening your friend group so you can also find your peace of mind with people that don't make you feel so astray, allowing you to not think too much how you don't belong to another group, because you know there is another that will always welcome you with open arms.

That would be my advice, I'm sorry it may not be the best, but I do hope it helps somehow

[–]oofreesouloo⚡super lesbian⚡[S] 7 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 0 fun8 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

Thank you so much for your advice. And I'm so sorry about the bullying you had to go through :( This is also a great advice. I really appreciate it. It's very true that when we have at least one friend that can truly accept us and know us is helps a lot. I used to have my best friend but due to lack of schedule incompatibility we drifted apart but try to be part of each other's lives. I'm going to try to deepen my already existing friendships and meet more people. Thank you. <3

[–]powpowpowpow 7 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 0 fun8 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

I'm sorry to hear that :( I hope you two can still keep at least some sort of contact, maybe schedule a day for lunch to catch up? Idk, but maybe even if that ends up not working out, your best friend is enough evidence to show that you can find people to relate to and find more support with!

Also, if you want to I would love to be your friend <3 you seem like a really awesome person so yea :D

[–]oofreesouloo⚡super lesbian⚡[S] 4 insightful - 2 fun4 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

Aww that's so sweet, of course we can be friends <3 feel free to pm me if you want and we can chat any time :)

[–]jim_steak 13 insightful - 1 fun13 insightful - 0 fun14 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

Hey, I've seen a few of your posts and I think they've started some good discussions on the sub - it's nice to take a break from the trans stuff sometimes. I'm sorry you've been having these difficult feelings around your attraction, but I think a lot of SSA people can relate to what you're saying. I've struggled in the past with feelings of discomfort around my SSA, which isn't exactly the same thing you're talking about but hopefully my experience is helpful. For me, what really helped was being aware of negative/unwanted thoughts, stopping them, and replacing them with positive thoughts. I also spent some time tracing back the origins of my thoughts/feelings and found situations from childhood were at the root of a lot of them. I found working out the logical history of my feelings and then sort of standing up for myself and taking my side against people who had harmed me really helped me feel more comfortable with myself. Hopefully that's helpful, I hope you feel more comfortable with your lack of attraction to men.

[–]oofreesouloo⚡super lesbian⚡[S] 9 insightful - 1 fun9 insightful - 0 fun10 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Thank you so much and I'm glad you enjoy my posts! :) I found your comment very insightful, I'm definitely going to give it a try, and instead of avoiding or acentuating the negative feelings, I'm going to face them instead and try to replace it with positive! I truly appreciate all your advice, very detailed and I'm sure it will help me somehow! <3

[–]Cass 8 insightful - 1 fun8 insightful - 0 fun9 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

Seems like a lot of your issues come from comparisons that you make yourself between you and the women you interact with. It would be worth it to explore in therapy where this impulse is stemming from and how you can transform it into something beneficial.

[–]oofreesouloo⚡super lesbian⚡[S] 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Thanks for your answer! Yeah, it's definitely caused by comparison. I will consider therapy, thank you!

[–]DimDroog 8 insightful - 1 fun8 insightful - 0 fun9 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

However, the thing I apparently clearly haven't accepted yet is the lack of attraction to men. I absolutely hate being different from other women.

Op, thank you for clearing something up.

I went through a similar thing not wanting children, and being told I was a freak et al, for hating the whole "culture" around pregnancy, childbirth, babies, etc.

It also shows, as someone below stated, how important it is for lesbians to be able to meet and have their own spaces.

I HOPE you will feel better!

[–]oofreesouloo⚡super lesbian⚡[S] 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

Thank you for your sweet answer! It's interesting how this sentiment can apply for other situations as well. Take care and hope you're well too <3

[–]DimDroog 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

You are welcome.

I never thought that lesbians would feel strange/bad for not being attracted to men.

I hope you find all the happiness in your life!

[–]oofreesouloo⚡super lesbian⚡[S] 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I mean, honestly being a lesbian ruined my teenage years. I feel like they were robbed from me. When you don't have a support system and everyone's constantly asking you if you have a boyfriend and about guys all the freaking time and all the trying to fit in was exhausting and I hated it and I still have problems on that as you can see. Thank you once again.

[–]lovelyspearmintLesbeing a lesbian 7 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 0 fun8 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

I would suggest you find some kind of therapy, such as a psychologist. I would also suggest you steer clear of any who specialise in LGBTQ people; they're not going to be any good for you. Yes, it's fine to have a good cry about what you're missing, but the best thing to do is to try and figure out how to deal with your issues, despite how impossible or difficult it may seem. Feeling depressed every time your girl friends mention men shouldn't be something you should accept for granted. Look into cognitive behaviour therapy and see if there are any tactics that will help you.

[–]oofreesouloo⚡super lesbian⚡[S] 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

Thank you so much :' I was actually thinking about going to a psychologist because I feel like I really need some (professional) help... This week already I'll meet the psychologist. Big hugs

[–]lovelyspearmintLesbeing a lesbian 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I wish you the best of luck!!! It's not an easy position to be in and it'll be tough for a while, but I'm sure you'll get through xo

[–]Destresse🇨🇵 6 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 0 fun7 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

Hmm. Maybe I can help. Lol.

Okay, what strikes me is this:

the thing I apparently clearly haven't accepted yet is the lack of attraction to men

You could break it down like this:

1- is the feeling related to other people? (what they think of you/what they expect/wanting to fit in) 2- or is it personal? (your own expectations/ideals/wishes)

What would being attracted to men give you that you feel you're lacking right now? (simplicity/security/a sense of belonging/...?)

Once you've identified what your actual need is, you can work on fulfilling it in other ways :)

[–]oofreesouloo⚡super lesbian⚡[S] 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

Great questions! I honestly think it's both 1 and 2, despite being more of 1 than 2. I was never a rebel kind of girl. I was always that kind of person who wants do the right things the right way since I was a kid. I enjoy following the 'rules'. Being homosexual kind of challenged me in a way it was perceived as something 'bad' and with stigma, whereas having a husband and kids would be the ""right"" thing to do according to society, you know? It was also very hard for me because of how society still perceives homosexuality. And also what people expect of me and wanting to fit in. Thanks a lot!! :)

[–]Elvira95Viva la figa 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

" I was never a rebel kind of girl. I was always that kind of person who wants do the right things the right way since I was a kid. I enjoy following the 'rules'. "

Awww what a model daughter. My exact opposite lol

[–]Elvira95Viva la figa 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

What about just not hanging out with straight girls anymore? It seems you really can't stand being around them

[–]oofreesouloo⚡super lesbian⚡[S] 9 insightful - 1 fun9 insightful - 0 fun10 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

It's not that I can't stand them, but it's very true that what I really really wanted was to hang out with other lesbians and bi women :'

[–]lovelyspearmintLesbeing a lesbian 9 insightful - 2 fun9 insightful - 1 fun10 insightful - 2 fun -  (1 child)

I would honestly take straight girls talking about men when the alternative is having to step around eggshells woque queers, lesbians and bisexual women.

[–]oofreesouloo⚡super lesbian⚡[S] 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

True !

[–]reluctant_commenter 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

Every time I'm with a group of women, I'm wishing they don't speak about guys and when they do, I get this instant depressive feeling, this is the word I could find that most accurately describes how I feel.

I have this experience, too. I described it in my comment to u/artemisiagrey but basically it's a feeling of dismay, like your heart dropping, like oh yeah, I forgot this was a thing. It feels alienating and "depressive" is a good word to describe it, too.

I've debated trying to talk to a couple of my close-ish friends, who are straight, about it, but there are a bunch of reasons why those conversations might go poorly-- they could get pissed off depending on their gender identity ideology views, they might just get awkward and have no idea what to say, etc.

Just wanted to say I relate, I feel the same way, and I appreciate you making this post. Hope we both get past this, and everyone else out there who is struggling with it. <3

[–]oofreesouloo⚡super lesbian⚡[S] 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Thank you for your answer! :) It's always great to know we're not the only ones dealing with this. I'm glad you appreciate your post. I wish you can overcome this as well, take care <3