How do you expect us to be a community if we can't discuss things?

submitted by [deleted] from self.SaidIt

So I've gained some insight about Saidit from my last post where I simply asked for clarification regarding Saidit's rules on porn. And what was the response to my questions? Instead of a discussion, it was nothing but a barrage of insults. I never once said I was for porn or wanted it posted here, but apparently people have zero reading comprehension because most of the responders believed that I did. Out of all the responses, Questionable's comment was the only reasonable disagreement instead of just a rant about porn.

So now I want to ask - what kind of community do you want Saidit to be? Just what do you expect to achieve from treating people like this?

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[–]filbs111 32 insightful - 2 fun32 insightful - 1 fun33 insightful - 2 fun -  (4 children)

I don't mind a bit of porn. I understand saidit, and many of the newer "free speech" platforms don't allow porn, which many see as hypocritical, but it's a pragmatic decision. For one thing, there are those that wish to see political speech shut down, and will use pornography as a tool to this end. I understand reddit's "Against Hate Subreddits" ("AHS") group has been known to post highly illegal pornography on reddit subs they didn't like, in order to get those subs shut down.

If a site has a policy that pornography is prohibited, and demonstrates enforcement of this policy, it's much harder to attack them using the media and law. If a site's policy is that porn is OK provided it's legal, this has a huge moderation cost, and then when someone posts illegal content, it's easier for those who wish to take the site down to claim that the site admins were turning a blind eye. Also, I suspect that much of the porn on sites like reddit is technically illegal (2257 regulations etc), but is tolerated because big orgs like reddit, mindgeek etc are "in bed with" the government...

In an ideal world, what would I want Saidit to be? Would I want to have porn and discussion in the same place? Sort of. This should be a goal of decentralised/federated services, and the internet as a whole. However, what is saidit as it stands? A bunch of subs, and a front page. Having porn on the same site would be handy because it might mean fewer logins. However, it's useful for a front page to be some sort of a "safe space" where people have informed expectations of what they're likely to see there. I like the idea that sex clubs exist, but also like the idea that a person should be able to walk down the street without seeing people fucking.

[–]adultxhumanxfemale 25 insightful - 2 fun25 insightful - 1 fun26 insightful - 2 fun -  (1 child)

I like the idea that sex clubs exist, but also like the idea that a person should be able to walk down the street without seeing people fucking.

This is a great analogy.

[–]Chipit 1 insightful - 3 fun1 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 3 fun -  (0 children)

But there are people who want to have sex in public. You're denying them their human rights.

[–]soundsalad 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

This should be a goal of decentralised/federated services

Why isn't Saidit decentralized? A blockchain version of Saidit would be ideal. Anything like this in the works?

[–]justcool393 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

that's more notabug.io's thing, which saidit participates in. I don't know what other "peers" that are out there (if there even are others) but there probably are NSFW things out there.

[–]dong_master 20 insightful - 4 fun20 insightful - 3 fun21 insightful - 4 fun -  (7 children)

We don't want degenerates like you here. Go jack off elsewhere.

[–]goobandit 4 insightful - 3 fun4 insightful - 2 fun5 insightful - 3 fun -  (6 children)

I disagree with the first half of this comment to say these degenerates can stay here, but agree with the other half stating that they need to go jack off elsewhere. No porn is stated plainly in the rules, but surely they have interests here besides porn...surely, I pray they do, please please please tell me they do ha

[–]Chipit 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (5 children)

surely they have interests here besides porn

Ha. I think you'd be disappointed to find out the truth. Very, very disappointed.

Why else are they so upset about it?

[–]goobandit 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (4 children)

I guess, it’s just a total bummer to think that’s all they care about. Even with all the chaos going on, the world is too fucking awesome to be complaining about not having porn everywhere.

[–]Chipit 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

That's the world we live in. I was shocked when the internet started to be a thing, and you got to see people's real lives. So many of them live tiny, sad lives with nothing in them. And the internet is ruthless with showing how great life can be...for those with the money and power to make it happen.

[–]goobandit 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

True, but everyone’s life is sad and tiny. That’s what power-hungry psychos are trying to defy. Trying to control the masses, trying to live forever. Ugh, enough internet for me, hope you have a good night/day

[–]Chipit 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

That's not true, you can have a rich life no matter where you are. It's just what you choose to do. Unfortunately too many dont realize they have choices and our media keeps hammering away at forcing unhappiness.

[–]goobandit 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I meant that everyone’s life is sad and tiny in the grand scheme of human history, but you do what you can to make yourself happy, to find your own purpose and contentment. And our media does have people convinced they are powerless to change how they feel, how they look at their environment, and at how they interact with others. No one seems to remember the idea of “kill your television” from the 1990s. Media overload does nothing but warp the way you interact with the world.

[–]Edge_Finder 20 insightful - 3 fun20 insightful - 2 fun21 insightful - 3 fun -  (2 children)

it simply states in the rules NO PORN, i've assholes send me dick pics already, and i fucking reported them

it the main reason of saidit that tells me this place is legit

so take your whimpering ass somewhere else, noone cares

you shit fucking troll

and I bet 99.9% that this post upvoted by you other or sick fucks that you know

[–]Extract 13 insightful - 1 fun13 insightful - 0 fun14 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

Check out this resource thread on shill tactics and this post becomes much more clear to you.

1) Identify division point (some people are ok with porn, others aren't).

2) Ask an "innocent" question as to the length of the boundaries related to this point ("So no porn allowed? Maybe just a bit? How about tits only?").

3-a) Get sympathetic response, push the boundaries farther, repeat the above (on a seemingly unrelated account) later on.
3-b) Get hostile response - wait a few days, then go cry about "the uncivil community" for defending its rules and their boundaries with passion.

Whether he did it on behalf of others or for his own coomer agenda is a different question, but the fact remains.

[–][deleted] 17 insightful - 2 fun17 insightful - 1 fun18 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

I see a number of helpful replies there so I think you're exaggerating. Sometimes you will receive replies you don't appreciate. Suck it up princess!

[–][deleted] 13 insightful - 2 fun13 insightful - 1 fun14 insightful - 2 fun -  (9 children)

Just ignore them. Block them preferably. Given where a lot of these people are coming from, and the kind of propaganda they constantly circlejerk over, they're not interested in a conversation. Put simply, a certain demographic on the internet tends to get banned for a good reason, and they're largely incapable of civility. That same sort of personality, rather than being ashamed at an inability to be civil, revels in it. My point is, these kinds of posts, and pleas to try to be reasonable or have discussion, are entirely lost on the same people you're pleading to.

[–][deleted]  (1 child)

[deleted]

    [–][deleted] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

    Ha.

    [–][deleted]  (1 child)

    [deleted]

      [–]Chipit 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

      The Left made war on civility for a reason.

      [–][deleted] 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (4 children)

      I see your point, but the thing is my original post was three days ago and I specifically waited to see if maybe some reasonable people would eventually come along, that maybe that was just an early onslaught of malcontents. I realize there will always be people who don't want to discuss things but just yell at each other, but if they're not just a few bad apples, if they're not even the half but the majority in this place, then what's to be the fate of Saidit?

      [–][deleted] 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

      They just invaded from Voat and Pol to keep trying to take over any place that will let them. They're not interested in conversation. At least, of the many I've challenged to have one, they certainly didn't want one. What they want are converts, people who will uncritically accept what they have to say. They just try to get rid of anybody else, especially people critical of their behavior. That's what Seven was joking about.

      [–]EuropeanAwakening 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

      oy vey

      [–]Penelope 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

      No one is "invading" from Voat or Pol, no more than being invaded by the reddit harassment subs, AHS and Srs. The people you think are invading are most likely Hasbara trolls.

      [–]LarrySwinger2 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

      Even when so many people post insults and upvote them, that still doesn't exclude it from being a (very) loud minority. I'm sure there's plenty of people who don't stand for that, but don't know what to say either. It isn't easy to call people out for their behaviour either, and there's no downvote button either to show disagreement with those insults. I've had people gang up on me randomly on Reddit, so I know how disheartening it can be. I feel like it's inherited from Reddit, in part because the voting system invites it, and in part as a tendency present in its userbase. Probably the majority of this site's userbase comes from Reddit after all. Anyway, I do think this should be addressed, considering that the pyramid of debate promises a better experience.

      [–]wrongthink 9 insightful - 3 fun9 insightful - 2 fun10 insightful - 3 fun -  (0 children)

      Wipe your tears off, grow the fuck up, and go coom somewhere else.

      [–]proc0 6 insightful - 2 fun6 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

      Maybe a small disclaimer could have helped clarify and discourage those comments. As to the previous post, arguably porn is not discussion so it doesn't belong in a "discussion forum". It's because of its graphic nature and also because it is used by spammers and trolls, that it requires a clear disclaimer that the conversation is in good nature.

      [–]Questionable 2 insightful - 8 fun2 insightful - 7 fun3 insightful - 8 fun -  (1 child)

      Gasp. I've been called out in public. How shall I react? What shall I wear?

      [–]ISaidWhatISaid 1 insightful - 2 fun1 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

      If I was you I'd wear very little but preferably more than usual ;P ;)

      [–]Extract 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

      From elsewhere:

      A free speech forum can still decide on the range of topics it wants to cover. If it doesn't want to cover porn, but you are free to speak of any other topic, it's still a free speech board, as long as other topics are not selectively censored based on things unrelated to the decided range of discussion topics.

      [–]Layman 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

      If ye diss and cuss each other is that discussing? How about communicating instead?

      [–][deleted] 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (4 children)

      I guess I am a hypocrite, I want this place to have all free speech, pics and videos are a form of free speech of course, but I don't like porn so it is not the kind of speech that is a priority of mine to defend. I wouldn't go and insult you for just asking questions about it though. No need for that.

      [–]Chipit 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

      It's not a free speech issue. It's a "we don't want that crap around" issue. It's way too much trouble, we know for a fact that reddit SJWs post nauseating porn to get places they don't like censored, and it's the freaking internet. There's porn everywhere.

      [–]Extract 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

      You are not a hypocrite.

      A free speech forum can still decide on the range of topics it wants to cover. If it doesn't want to cover porn, but you are free to speak of any other topic, it's still a free speech board, as long as other topics are not selectively censored based on things unrelated to the decided range of discussion topics.

      [–][deleted] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

      nah it should allow all free speech. This isn't a free speech forum though of course, it's owners decide what to allow. Like others said it's cuz they're afraid of the govt taking this down since they often use porn as an excuse to do that.

      [–]Extract 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

      "nah it should" let me stop you right there.
      The forum owners decide what topics it should or shouldn't include. The only thing anybody else decides is whether those topics are to their linking enough to use the forum.
      It's the same concept as "Freedom Of Speech" not granting you the ability to enter a library and start playing Hard Metal - while it's your right to do so in the public square, it's not your right to use it disrupt a part of the public square dedicated to something else.

      [–]Vigte 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

      I noticed a similar thing recently: people tend to assume that anything OP posts, the OP must agree completely with - when in fact they have no idea if you're posting something you disagree with to expose it - or even just to make fun of it.

      [–]Sw0rdofDam0cles 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

      Are you male or female?

      [–]nonamez 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

      This is just the extreme right version of reddit. Reddit was just too extreme left. This place is the same. Whenever a right wing shithead responds to me on here I just block them. I received insults from a lot of retards on here. I just block them. I don't engage or respond with the extreme right morons on here.

      [–]Chipit 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

      "Everyone I refuse to listen to is a racist I know for a fact they are racist because I refuse to talk to them"

      Will you ever realize that you're the problem?

      Of course there's good that comes from listening, even to "racists". You might find out that some people that you thought were racist aren't who you thought they were.

      [–]Thisfuckingworld 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

      Piggybacking cos the captcha has gone and done crack, how detailed can I go into 'fuck x' here?

      [–]send_nasty_stuff 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

      Most people that ask for clarification on porn are seeking to post porn. Unless you explicitly state your intentions you can't blame people for reading into your intent. It's a little like going to an AA meeting and asking about the details of the no booze rule.