How many people here were once liberals? ✋

submitted by [deleted] from self.politics

Just curious.

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[–]IridescentAnaconda 7 insightful - 3 fun7 insightful - 2 fun8 insightful - 3 fun -  (3 children)

Yes, I was once a normie NPC fag.

Still a gay man, but the last 2 years have moved me very far to the right.

[–][deleted] 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun -  (2 children)

You should cash in on that like Mila Yiannopoulos or Caitlyn Jenner. The right loves gays on their side. And backsides!

What changed your mind?

[–]IridescentAnaconda 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I was actually never a flaming leftist like you see a lot of gay guys, but I was kind of "center left" and aware of / sympathetic to some concerns of right leaning people (e.g. even before the pandemic I could see through the bullshit of feminism). But early in the pandemic I could very clearly see how the whole thing was being manipulated for the benefit of certain interests, and I started to question a number of cherished beliefs. And then the martyrdom of St. George happened and I totally noped out.

One of the hardest things has been admitting maybe the RW Christians were right about the "slippery slope" and gay marriage. You can't prove them wrong now! I still love my spouse and glad I'm with him but holy fuck our culture is degenerate.

Edit: on the subject of Milo, he claims to be no longer gay. And I have a real job, I don't need to prostitute myself on social media. Caitlyn Jenner is an autogynephile straight man.

[–]VulptexVoluntaryist 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

They used to, not so much this past year or two. I don't know what happened, other than that they now let their opposition define them. So if the liberals love or claim to love something, they hate it.

[–][deleted] 7 insightful - 2 fun7 insightful - 1 fun8 insightful - 2 fun -  (14 children)

How do you define liberal?

[–][deleted] 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (10 children)

I was thinking about people who underwent public school indoctrination. You missed out on that one.

[–]AntarchomachusAnarchist 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (9 children)

Not clear on what 'liberal' really means in colloquial usage anymore either tbh. Anyone 'left of center'? A neo-liberal?

Up until very recently I preferred 'liberals' to 'conservatives' (Leftists like the ACLU used to protect free speech, not the right who tended to be a bit puritanical), but don't think I've ever been a great representative of this group.

[–]VulptexVoluntaryist 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (5 children)

Leftists like the ACLU used to protect free speech, not the right who tended to be a bit puritanical

It's the opposite I think. Until very recently conservatives strongly supported free speech, now all they care about is purging "degeneracy". This is because they started letting their opposition define them after the Minneapolis riots started a war between them.

Of course liberals have still only gotten even more pro-censorship themselves. The only thing protecting any freedom at all now is the power struggle.

[–]AntarchomachusAnarchist 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (4 children)

It's the opposite I think. Until very recently conservatives strongly supported free speech

I'm going to challenge this. Historically it has been the evangelical christian right that has been behind the vast majority of censorship efforts in the US. Other instances have usually been related to managing public perception in times of war, which both parties have engaged in.

Journal article on the history of censorship in the US

https://journals.ala.org/index.php/jifp/article/view/7208/10294

[–]VulptexVoluntaryist 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

The fringe fire and brimstone preachers yes, but they were also historically Democrats.

[–]AntarchomachusAnarchist 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

Yes...but they were still (social)conservatives. Democrats and Republicans just swapped liberal and conservative ideologies.

But yeah, the changing, ill defined nature of these words is obviously a problem

[–]VulptexVoluntaryist 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

Why does it matter? And most of the same people who were social conservatives are now progressives.

[–]AntarchomachusAnarchist 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Why does it matter?

Because my original point had to do with conservatives and liberals, not democrats per se

And most of the same people who were social conservatives are now progressives.

I agree with you that these words are used in so many different ways that they are now essentially meaningless

[–][deleted] 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

Not clear on what 'liberal' really means in colloquial usage anymore either tbh. Anyone 'left of center'? A neo-liberal?

The CNN/MSNBC/Reuters crowd. The people who read those sources and that's their reality.

I enjoyed talking with the neolib crowd on Reddit. Wasn't really sure what they were all about, but I just looked and they're quite insane. Still, didn't ban me for my opinion, which is more than I can say for most liberal subs.

ACLU

They should be out defending Joe Rogan for his freedom to say any number of offensive things. It's so sad that organization has gone to shit. We could really use something like the ACLU.

Up until very recently I preferred 'liberals' to 'conservatives

Same, their core values changed.

[–]AntarchomachusAnarchist 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

The CNN/MSNBC/Reuters crowd. The people who read those sources and that's their reality.

Not them, but I did used to think Jon Stewart and Steven Colbert were credible news sources.

I enjoyed talking with the neolib crowd on Reddit. Wasn't really sure what they were all about, but I just looked and they're quite insane

Yes I have an Uncle who is one of these insane people, lol

[–][deleted] 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

I think I was wrong since you further clarified in private, you should share your experience. Should anyways, I mean, it's a forum.

[–][deleted] 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

My political experience isn't too interesting. I was 11 when 9/11 happened and I was pretty excited about blowing up another country, and pissing off my parents by disagreeing with them. But as I got deeper into things it became clear that the truth is almost impossible to reach. Oh, and I was homeschooled.

[–]jet199 7 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 0 fun8 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I'm still liberal.

I believe people should be able to do what they like if they aren't hurting others (and hurty words don't count).

It's just Americans use the word liberal to mean something else.

[–][deleted] 5 insightful - 3 fun5 insightful - 2 fun6 insightful - 3 fun -  (3 children)

Yesterday, I woke up sucking a lemon

[–]Foidblaster9000 3 insightful - 4 fun3 insightful - 3 fun4 insightful - 4 fun -  (2 children)

wat

[–][deleted] 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

What I meant to say was:

If you’re not a liberal when you’re 25, you have no heart. If you’re not a conservative by the time you’re 35, you have no brain.

This is a natural trajectory that OP brings up. Maybe because commie logic is only effective on young people. They do go after the kids.

[–][deleted] 1 insightful - 3 fun1 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 3 fun -  (0 children)

He said:

Yesterday, I woke up sucking a lemon

[–]StillLessons 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Interesting poll. I believe this group is larger than we think.

I considered myself liberal through Bush II (an NPR liberal). I was willing to give Obama a chance to show that the Dems still had the integrity to undo what Bush II had done. Then witnessed what Obama did in the first 3 months of his first term (2009), and have never looked back. Both Democrats and Republicans are at this point thoroughly corrupt, to the point of genuine moral and spiritual evil. Once I got off the reservation, my willingness to look beyond the two-party script led me to the recognition that the Uni-party has had control certainly since 1913, and probably before. Now for the most part sitting back and observing the ongoing collapse, looking for opportunities to operate locally at small-scale to create replacement mechanisms to move forward as the centralized monolith we all depend on dies.

It's quite a show.

[–]theytookourjerbsIndependent 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

Socially, I was extremely progressive, so I guess on the social end I was more liberal. Economically, I was more pro-capitalist, but I've recently moved a tad bit left economically, but still center there. I was a socially progressive right-libertarian, and I'm now less socially progressive center-libertarian. I've moved a tad bit authoritarian recently. So basically I was like -8 libertarian, like +3 right and progressively like +7 or +8. Now the results put me -6 libertarian, 0 center and +5.4 progressive socially. https://sapplyvalues.github.io/ I'm currently registered Libertarian party, but mainly vote a mixture of Green, Independent and Libertarian, and it usually depends on how they're aligned libertarian wise on that link I have earlier.

[–][deleted] 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

As of this instance of the test, I scored: X: +5.33, Y: -2.33, Z: 0.94.

What would you label that as possibly?

[–]AntarchomachusAnarchist 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I would call that libertarian in terms of American party politics. Economically very right, but significantly left on social issues.

Heres me, a self-identified anarchist: X: -6.33, Y: -5.33, Z: 6.88 https://imgur.com/a/qute85b

[–][deleted] 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

I was. /puke

[–]yabbit 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

I was redpill now I'm incel.

[–][deleted] 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

I was before my brain fully developed.

[–]jykylsin2034 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

Commie, then normal dem, then corona hit and I went Republican, then libertarian, then fascist, then monarchist, flip flopped between the fasc/monarch a bunch now I'm somewhere between them.

[–][deleted] 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Interesting. I'm sort of torn between libertarian and fascism. Fascism is great in an ethno-state, but it can't work in the current-day admixture of races, religions, moral "values" and traditions.

Libertarianism has issues too obviously, and with the moral degeneracy of our time, a sudden shift to a libertarian state would result in massive chaos. That's not necessarily good either.

[–]rubberbiscuit 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

If caring for the environment is liberal, I was liberal, and still am to an extent. Except to environmentalists nowadays there is 1 focus and 1 focus only: climate change. Which I care nothing about (not sure it is real, human caused, and if we can do anything about it anyway, but even if we could... China). I just want to swim in clean water, have places that aren't full of trash, breathe somewhat clean air. Allow us to live healthy nature-filled lives not preservatives and then pharmaceutical medicines to solve the problems of all the above.

[–]iDontShift 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (4 children)

rep - lib - now neither

the only way out is personal liberation thru realization God is all there is

if you see us all as part of the same being it makes less sense to seek to dominate it, control it. or anything

it also removes your victim identity, for all that happens to you .. you do it to yourself.. and you see it clearly

why are we doing this current scenario? it is the culmination of all our desires and feelings.. and unfortunately many are not happy and not understanding and in so doing propagate that feeling on to the next generations until some start to notice and slow down and not accept the programming

[–][deleted] 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

What is the answer to this paradox: If all we love is God and there is only one objective way or objective preference, then there is no individual freedom.

[–][deleted] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

In what sense do you define “freedom”? Does 2 + 2 = 4 being objective limit your freedom?

[–][deleted] 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I define freedom as being sovereign to operate however you please, collectively in the nation sense, not just the purely individual sense. As long as you don't infringe on the practices of other nations, it is all good.

[–]iDontShift 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

you can't imagine what you'd do if you where not in direct competition with everyone else?

is that really a question or simply a possibility that hasn't occured to you?

because i tell you what I'd do..

ENJOY MYSELF CONSTANTLY ..

go sky diving

go skiing

go surfing

ride motorcycles super fast

climb trees

have sex

enjoy the company of others

enjoy healthy competition with others

enjoy breathing

my God... you people can't even imagine happiness

[–][deleted] 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

A conservative, then an independent, then a conservative Democrat, then merely a Democrat, then a liberal Democrat (neo-Lib), then a Bernie Democrat, then merely a Democrat, but anti-DNC, then conserative Democtrat today. So - different flavors of liberal/conservative at times when the political climate changed significantly.

[–]Trajan 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Yes, and I began to refine my views during the Atheism+ degeneracy, questioning many positions I had taken as a given.

While remaining pretty socially liberal, I now realise there are ideologies and practices that are too degenerate to be tolerated.

[–]chadwickofwv 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I considered myself a liberal when I was young and extremely dumb.

[–]tyranicaloverlord 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I'm would be a liberal in the 90s. I haven't changed much of what I believe in, and now I am considered a conservative.

I don't want to be associated with the modern left, they are fucking insane.

[–][deleted]  (1 child)

[removed]

    [–]MarkimusNational Justice Party 4 insightful - 2 fun4 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

    /u/d3rr /u/magnora7 bot account spamming the chat and posting random comments