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[–]Dragonerne 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (16 children)

I'm sorry but I don't have to take your abusive and gaslighting language.

Black people have it shitty, white people have it shitty.

There are not "two sides" to this, when you have literal laws and policies that discriminate against whites simply for having the wrong skin color.
Your response was expected after your defence of BLM. This is why I didn't bother finding sources to educate you on this topic. History will judge.

[–]zerosis 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (15 children)

Gaslighting? Abuse? Really? You have got to be trolling me right now, dude. If I was trying to be abusive, I'd call you stupid for repeatedly parroting tired leftist talking points in an attempt to validate your white oppression card. I don't think you are, though, I think you're just being willfully obtuse, even though you're probably fully capable of coherent thought. BLM being obnoxious doesn't detract from the fact that white people don't have it that bad right now, or ever in this country, really. If white people were THAT oppressed, we wouldn't have a fucking white president, for christ's sake. Or 44 white presidents.

Ah, of course THAT'S why you can't provide sources. Ok.

[–]Dragonerne 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (14 children)

Deny, deny, deny. Gaslight, gaslight, gaslight. Abuse, abuse, abuse.
"Source?" "Source?"
"BLM isn't racist. Blacks have it really hard."
"Stop playing the victim card, you whitey"
"You're being willfully obtuse"

Sorry, I've debated too many on reddit like this. So yes, I was expecting that.

If you want an actual conversation between two normal people, then you need to first apologize for claiming that I was not taking the conversation seriously, your comment about my "true motives. Christ", your comment about me being like a caricature of a white racist, your comment about people like me being the downfall of saidit, you calling me willfully obtuse.
And then, after apologizing for that, you would spend 5 seconds to type "Affirmative action" into google and click on one of the first links to educate yourself on this topic, and then I might consider forgiving you but I very likely wont, because I would feel uncomfortable and fearing that you might relapse and continue the abuse.

[–]zerosis 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (13 children)

Don't know if you noticed, dude, but I was having a polite conversation until you turned the tide toward abusive language. I wasn't kidding when I asked for a source, I was still debating you in good faith at that point, and I was interested and open in what you had to say, but obviously you had nothing real to show. If you're that concerned about having a 'normal conversation between two people,' you should have stayed civil.

I'm kind of amused at how far you're willing to take this parroting, though. It's kind of endearing in a way. The asking for an apology bit is a little on the nose, I would advise against going that far next time, it isn't really spicy enough to hold up to the 'abuse' tantrum thing you have going on.

[–]Dragonerne 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (12 children)

After calling me names, obtuse, etc. forgive me for not really caring at this point. If you want to know more, spend 5 seconds on google.

[–]zerosis 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (11 children)

Cared enough to refuse to cite your claims again, I guess

[–]Dragonerne 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (10 children)



The first one is about blacks being given bonus points in hiring, university etc. I expect you to either dismiss it, start justifying it, say that it's not that bad or that whites deserve the discrimination.

The only reason I did this is because I could see that you're against TRAs. I'm too used to their abuse on reddit and tbh you were in the wrong for how you attacked me. You could've been less rude instead of acting like TRAs. If you continue in that way, then I'm out.

[–]zerosis 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (9 children)

I will read your sources thoroughly and come to my own conclusion, because I still am genuinely interested in the socio-political ramifications of affirmative action and I'm still not sure how I feel about it overall. I view it as a complicated issue, just like systemic racial discrimination against white/black people. That is literally all I wanted in that regard and the snip about how you expect me to 'react' isn't necessary.

It's really strange that you're trying to paint me as the aggressive one here when you're saying shit like 'you would be free to move back to your home country' (Americans are American regardless of their skin color or ancestry, it's not a white ethnostate) and 'there are not two sides to this,' (<- seriously? What happened to All Lives Matter? Black people have issues just like white people, this should not be some controversial statement in any circle.) also completely ignoring my point about the statues where I said it would be JUST as bad to monumentalize a person who enslaved, colonized and murdered white people. You put my good-faith arguments on full blast and decided there was no room for agreement, when we don't even disagree on everything. I didn't attack you, I was responding in kind to your own antagonization.

[–]Dragonerne 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (8 children)

The reason I wrote that snip is because you previously dismissed my expectation as if I had been lying.
I personally don't see affirmative action as a complicated issue. Treating white women worse than black women just because they're white should not be codified in law. Each individual is unique and ought to be treated equally.

I'm liberal at heart but if society deems it acceptable to discriminate against white women and white men, then my liberalism goes out the window. If racism is part of the game, then I prefer that it benefits white men and women rather than discriminate against them.

It's really strange that you're trying to paint me as the aggressive one here when you're saying shit like 'you would be free to move back to your home country' (if you're advocating for ethno-states then there's only so many ways I can beat around the bush without just asking 'why be racist though')

No, I disagree. I also didn't advocate for an ethnostate, I replied to your comment about normaltivity. If a chinese man doesn't like the sexual preferences of white women, then he can return to his own country. It's not the job of white women to change for him and no one should feel forced to have certain sexual preferences.

and 'there are not two sides to this,' (<- seriously? What happened to All Lives Matter? Black people have issues just like white people, this should not be some controversial statement in any circle.)

Yes, seriously. All Lives Matter is still true, but there are laws, rules and policies that directly discriminate against whites. This needs to be fixed and there are not two sides to this because there are no laws, rules or policies that directly discriminate against blacks. Blacks are systemically and institutionally privileged by society.

I didn't attack you, I was responding in kind to your own antagonization.

You did attack me. I might've been direct but nowhere did I call you obtuse or anything like that.

[–]zerosis 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (7 children)

I only dismissed your original refusal to post sources because you initially refused to post sources. It's that simple.

You completely missed the point about why asking an American to 'move back to their home country' is ridiculous. America isn't white, it's a melting pot. There are plenty of asian, black and white people here to go around, for whatever tastes you might have. You keep shifting the argument away from the original point of contention, which is that black people have frustrations with the ramifications of being regularly looked down on in their own country. White people might have their own frustrations, but that doesn't mean black American's concerns aren't important. I don't understand why this simple concept is so hard to accept.

Claiming that blacks are systemically and institutionally priveleged in America is ridiculous. Hyper-woke twitter doesn't speak for the rest of the country, there is still PLENTY of racism to go around for every color under the sun. You're being extremist about this and you really don't need to be. It's okay to acknowledge the struggles of both black and white people in America, despite what the far left might tell you about whites and the far right might tell you about blacks.

And again you won't address the fact that I stated why our viewpoints on the statue situation aren't even incompatible. If there was a statue erected in honor of someone who colonized, enslaved and killed white people on a grand scale, would you want it on display in a public park? Or would you find it in bad taste and offensive to your people? Or is your overly snarky 'Yes of course you don't blame them. I'm not surprised.' supposed to tell me what you actually think about this?

You repeatedly called me, a complete and total stranger, an abuser and gaslighter (meaningless buzzword at this point) over a simple disagreement in opinion, so don't act like calling you obtuse was just some out-of-nowhere low brow hit. You engaged with me on aggressive terms and keep trying to play the victim card. Come on, man, that just doesn't make sense.