Rape by deception and “Passing”

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-13T18:47:35+00:00

I’m deeply uncormtable with the idea that this would be called rape. Essentially anything could be “potentially disqualifying” so it opens the door to calling anyone who didn’t write an autobiography for a potential partner a rapist.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-13T17:50:26+00:00

Nah just sad and bad at everything but not smart enough to stop trying.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-13T17:40:37+00:00

I was a shitty lawyer. Turns out I’m stupid but just good at standardized tests.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-13T17:23:22+00:00

Im sure you will crack a bottle when we are denied any semblance of safety.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-13T16:46:57+00:00

That doesn’t follow at all. Also we don’t have info on Trans men’s brains. They’re understudied.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-13T16:45:27+00:00

You all are actively campaigning for them to turn their backs on us. Drop the t and all that. Not to mention that there’s not even consensus among us because of the fact that it could be used as justification to alienate us if we were separated as non women. Im for it but it’s not something all trans people want.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-13T16:42:42+00:00

I personally believe it’s from both. A structural predilection and societal pressure to conform to identity contrary to interest. But it needs more research.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-13T15:07:17+00:00

Because gays and lesbians pushed for it.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-13T13:42:19+00:00

The TRA movement is one of the most well-funded and powerful "civil rights" movements in history.

No it isn’t. Trans people have as a group essentially no resources. Dedicated trans resources (as opposed to collective lgbt resources) basically don’t exist. You’ve rolled into full secret government levels of conspiracy theory.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-13T13:38:57+00:00

You read a lot of anger into my statements that just isn’t there. You ever consider you may just be projecting?

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-13T13:37:52+00:00

Because we are a tiny, largely hated, portion of the population that is definitionally not necessary to society. We don’t have power for change.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-13T05:44:12+00:00

I gave you a path that doesn’t depend on trans women not being women right there.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-13T04:54:52+00:00

Because you are the ones arguing for policies that harm us. You are pushing for change, you own the result.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-13T04:53:47+00:00

I never made a change. Trans women have been using women’s rooms for as long as I’ve been alive.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-13T04:52:28+00:00

It’s still coming from you. You demand us out of women’s spaces. We can’t be in men’s spaces. So you want third spaces to get us away from you without undue harm. How isn’t that a platform to take?

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-13T04:38:46+00:00

A boot on the neck and male threatening display. Absolute madness.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-13T04:36:54+00:00

I suspect we are.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-13T04:31:48+00:00

They’re not a possibility that we can engineer. They can’t come from us. Not that they can’t exist.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-13T04:29:58+00:00

Then how would sharing a title be a slap in the face?

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-13T04:27:20+00:00

I’m fine sharing. And pose no threat.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-13T04:21:34+00:00

Now that you've acknowledged that "after transition" TW are still stronger than women, will you acknowledge that this causes them to have the upper hand, as it were, in physical contests with women - and this is turn puts women at physical risk from TW who might wish to bully, intimidate, injure or sexually assault us ?

I’m not convinced of that though I’m also not convinced we aren’t. Enough in question that I am against out participation in sport but I am not convinced it takes place in general safety.

A larger heart won’t stop a man from killing me.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-13T04:11:30+00:00

We aren’t even influential here. Where I am I have employment protections federally and literally no other protections since my state has none.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-13T04:06:26+00:00

Numbers, resources, public opinion, the fact that any such movement would be used to further marginalize us as evidence we aren’t really women. Take your pick.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-13T03:24:55+00:00

Because you lump us in with men and then immediately assume wild and untrue privilege.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-13T03:23:58+00:00

But also aren’t going to do anything in furtherance of them.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-13T03:11:37+00:00

Nice to know you think that we are so much below you that using the same word is a slap in the face.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-13T03:09:53+00:00

As long as we pretended we aren’t who we are and abandon all pride you might help us. How magnanimous.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-13T03:05:07+00:00

You are arguing for policies that hurt us. The acting like any harm is our responsibility.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-13T02:38:10+00:00

I’ve said repeatedly I prefer third spaces so please don’t play that game. I don’t actually like making people uncomfortable.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-13T02:16:23+00:00

It’s been a few years but it was a us centric interest survey.

I wouldn’t trust anything from Blanchard. His most famous research is so wildly specious and ignorant it’s impossible to even address. He doesn’t believe bisexual trans people can exist. He just says we are heterosexual and confused. “Pseudo bisexual”

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-13T02:12:44+00:00

What are you doing to make sure Flint has water? What are you doing to make sure the children of illegal immigrants who have been separated from their parents are being taken care of and returned to their families? Are you sponsoring the people in other countries who need food and shelter?

No but I’m Also not advocating for their situation to be worse.

As to the shelters, I donate when I can and Work with the local food bank but not more than that.

If you aren’t willing to help them stop arguing for policies that hurt us.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-13T02:06:05+00:00

It’s impossible for trans women to be safe in men’s spaces. They can’t be improved to make trans women safe. It can’t be done.

Third spaces or women’s spaces are the only way that we can be safe. And we can’t engineer third spaces. That change can’t come from us.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-13T02:01:57+00:00

But you also are actively against doing anything in furtherance of them while trying to push us out of women’s spaces. Realistically there’s no functional distance.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-13T02:00:58+00:00

The word doesn’t naturally apply to anyone. But frankly I’m too tired for the language discussion at this point. To be put simply I don’t think calling myself a woman harms women. Because I am one.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-13T01:56:49+00:00

Way to prove my Point.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-13T01:26:04+00:00

This is not true! Males who "transition" become slightly weaker compared to how they were previously, and to how they would be had they not mucked about with their hormones, but they do not come anywhere near the strength levels of female people. And they certainly don't become weaker than women.

I didn’t say weaker than women I said weaker than men. And substantially so.

And heart volume isnt relevant we aren’t talking about sports we are talking about being attacked by men.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-13T01:14:44+00:00

There’s nothing baseless about this. “You should go to male prisons and have to use male facilities” if enacted as a policy would lead to trans women being harmed. You can’t possibly deny that.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-13T01:13:21+00:00

No it wouldn’t. It would be 66 percent attracted to men and 66 percent attracted to women. Bi people would apply to both.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-13T01:05:16+00:00

You are actively pushing for us to be treated like men in all respect. The direct result of that is us being stuck with men and subjected to their violence. It’s a direct causal link. Just because it isn’t your fist doesn’t mean you aren’t cheering on the cause of it landing.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-13T01:03:34+00:00

And also that most are attracted to men. As I said.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-13T01:01:38+00:00

Then stop pushing for policies that get violence done to us?

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-13T00:53:54+00:00

I didn’t say that they were. Political eunuchs and such existed, but so did those who didn’t want to be seen as men.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-13T00:48:50+00:00

The only large scale survey I ever saw had trans women as approximately 33 percent straight, 33 percent bi, and 33 percent gay. That means the majority are attracted to men.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-13T00:46:21+00:00

But gender identity is in the brain.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-13T00:07:53+00:00

Enough to matter.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-13T00:07:21+00:00

Transitioned trans women are physically weaker. I wish you would stop presenting that wasn’t true.

I can’t speak to Argentina but I can say that trans people in my country had no national level protections ok any kind until lasts year when the Supreme Court decided that we should have employment protections. We still have no other protections on the national level. Like none. I don’t know if you understand our legal situation fully.

Abortion is a separate issue because of the religious “this is murder” component. They aren’t mutually exclusive and I for what it’s worth am vocally pro choice.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-12T23:53:23+00:00

Every trans person and every supportive non trans person doesn’t seem like a tiny group.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-12T23:50:11+00:00

Identity has always been about the brain.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-12T23:10:35+00:00

I’m saying appearance matters to how trans people are treated. That’s it.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-12T23:02:11+00:00

eating disorders

Thank you. Kind of sad I didn’t think of that given I have one.

To the second paragraph I’m not telling you what you experince but basically yeah. No one ever heals. You learn to cope or medicate. You don’t fix a broken brain, you learn to work broken.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-12T22:56:19+00:00

Because you ate conflating male and men in a way that we don’t agree with.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-12T22:50:09+00:00

They’re even harder to Justify if society considers us as “men asking for even more”.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-12T22:48:22+00:00

Depends on your perspective I imagine.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-12T22:47:41+00:00

Women cannot solve male on male violence. If you didn't notice, men don't listen when women speak up about male on female violence. I don't know why you think men would act different if women speaked up against male on male violence.

You have a better chance than we do.

And you aren’t saying “hurt them” but you are saying to treat us like men and lock us up with men. That’s not much of a distinction.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-12T22:43:39+00:00

But they are treated differently.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-12T22:43:02+00:00

You don’t stop having BPD or Being traumatized. You learn to cope or medicate but you don’t just stop. Coping mechanisms like say changing your body to better fit yourself for taking medication to feel better. Like transition.

I don’t know what you mean by the ED part. I’m assuming you don’t mean Ehlers Danlos.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-12T22:36:16+00:00

It doesn’t. It differentiates between men and trans women on a structural level. That’s my point.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-12T22:28:55+00:00

You can’t change your core. You can learn to cope. You can learn to understand the state your in but you can’t untraimatize a brain.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-12T22:27:52+00:00

I never said girlbrain. I said probably a structural basis for dysphoria based on observed commonalities in brain structures in trans women. That’s not saying trans women have “women’s brains”.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-12T22:26:21+00:00

It feels right because it feels right. Like how your name sounds right. It just doesn’t produce an aversion. Not because I am effeminate. Man, by contrast, produces a visceral negative reaction.

I’ve given a list based definition before and you all said it wasn’t sufficient so I’m not going to give you one. Woman feels right, man feels disgusting. It’s really not more complicated than that for me at this point. Leave the analysis to people smarter than me.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-12T22:22:29+00:00

Which structures in the brain? I’m Not a neuroscientist but I do recall a study showing that trans women had white matter formations in the brain distinct from men.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-12T22:20:52+00:00

She literally said. “That’s for you to sort you amongst yourselves”. In what way is that distinct from “I’m fine with this happening”?

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-12T22:06:34+00:00

Some people think the Earth is flat and there is a great conspiracy to hide this "fact". It doesn't make it true.

But that’s a factual question not a language question.

As to the rest. Inclusion of trans women doesn’t undo women’s progress in any of those areas. And the needs of a passing trans woman and a natal woman are functionally identical outside of a medical context.

You want to throw us to the wolves and act like it simply isn’t your concern when we get eaten. You act like trans people have the political capital to magically rewrite all of society to just add a third category to everything and increase all separate spaces by 50 percent. It’s functionally impossible. At least stop acting like we could just change shit like that. Even if every trans person decided to abandon self respect and start begging for a third option it just wouldn’t happen. We have a binary society and that isn’t going to be changed by a bunch of freaks you yourself admit most people hate.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-12T21:41:31+00:00

if you expect we don’t treat you like one

This has always been my point. If you treat trans women like men, we don’t get protections because men don’t need protections. We never get access to faculties because “the men’s is right there”. We get shoved unprotected into male prisons to be rape dolls because “they’re still men afterall”. The reason trans women have had to struggle with nothing for a century and the reason that we suffer at the hands of men who want us to act like “real men” is exactly because you all want to treat us as just men.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-12T21:36:26+00:00

Trans women are denied access to those spaces. You are saying we shouldn’t be in yours and the imminent threat of bodily injury says we can’t be in the other. In what way is that not being restricted?

I don't think any surgeries done on "male to female transsexuals" 90 years ago are analogous to what's called "bottom surgery" today. The modern method of penile inversion to create a pelvic cavity was pioneered by Georges Burou in the late 1950s. However, male castration has been around for thousands of years.

The Hirschfeld (etc) surgeries were at least analogous and were conducted in the early 1930’s. And castration to distance yourself from being seen as a man has existed for thousands of years and was the best available option for dysphoria then. I’m glad you can acknowledge that.

As for the Hijra in India/South Asia - this and other similar categories in other cultures are special sex castes created for gay men to separate them from other men. Hijra have nothing to do with women.

They aren’t treated as men. It’s not a sub class of men. They aren’t seen or treated as men which is precisely my point.

Male-on-male violence is for males to sort out amongst yourselves.

So you admit you are fine with sending trans women to be rape toys for men?

Putting males who identify as trans into women's prisons doesn't just guarantee that women will be raped, it guarantees that women will be locked in with males who will menace, intimidate, bully, perv on and otherwise abuse them - and some women will become pregnant as a result.

Putting a trans woman in women’s prison in no way guarantees any of those things. Leaving aside the utter lack of proof of violent crime rates among trans women that’s a wild swing. Hell most trans women couldn’t even impregnate someone.

You know I’m not even arguing for putting trans women with natal women though. I’ve always said dedicated facilities were the best answer but have fun fighting the straw man.

Most males who identify as trans are sexually attracted to women

And most trans women are attracted to men. Being gay doesn’t predispose you to violence.

The ones who end up in prison have very high rates of sexual offending against women and children.

Unless I’m wrong the statistsics you cite include prostitition which makes that statistic as violence indicator suspect at best.

Even homosexual males who identify as trans are often misogynistic and full of rage towards women, and since they have male bodies and assets like male grip strength, upper body size and hand size, they can easily overpower females.

Trans women don’t have the same bodies as gay men. Hormones preicipitously reduce strength and gay men are less hated than trans women and less likely to be subject to violence. A trans woman on hormones cannot win a fight against a cis man. Ever.

Also, trans-identified males are not the only ones who are vulnerable to physical and sexual assault by other males in prison. If this one group of guys should be put in with the women, why not all males who are skinny, frail, weak, good-looking, very young, old, sickly, physically disabled, mentally slow, traumatized, mentally ill and so on? Why not all the males who are child molesters or serving time for collecting images of children being sexually abused by other men? After all, "nonces" are at great risk of assault and rape by other males in prison too.

Because most of them are physically able and therefore better able to protect themselves and also to hurt natal and trans women. They have “high risk” wards but trans women aren’t any safer than than in male genpop. Also trans women don’t pose the sexual risk cis men do.

Women's health care needs have been ignored since medicine began. A lot more money and resources have been and are being put into "trans health care" than into areas like endometriosis, pregnancy complications, high maternal mortality, childbirth injuries, menopause and the health problems of elderly women. Now gynecologists are being expected to provide health care and prescribe and monitor the pharmaceutical hormones of trans-identified persons of both sexes. Males who identify as trans are also demanding that gynecologists provide them with care following genital surgeries, and prostate exams too. This is diverting time, attention, resources and knowledge from female-specific health care and giving it to males with male-specific health care issues. How is this just?

How is me being denied a flu shot because I am trans? How is that trans women who died a few years back (I believe in Pakistan but I am not positive) after 6 hours in a lobby because they wouldn’t put her in the men’s or women’s wards? How is when you being told by a gp that they won’t prescribe you medicine for an unrelated condition unless you stop hormones “just in case”?

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-12T21:15:23+00:00

It’d be awful quiet here with me. Someone s gotta keep the lamp lit.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-12T21:14:32+00:00

The way society treats us it’s very much about looks. That’s why so many gc posts are just mocking trans women’s appearances.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-12T21:13:48+00:00

Define large scale. Every trans person plus all trans inclusive non trans people is an appreciable number by most standards.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-12T20:48:13+00:00

Talking about me and respectable trans people are 2 different things. If you are lucky enough to transition early and pass you can find actual acceptance and have a good life. Someone like me? The best we got is pity and getting by, but it beats pretending to be a man.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-12T20:45:48+00:00

Large scale alternate usage is how definitions form.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-12T20:27:20+00:00

I’m not talking about functionality. I’m talking about identity. What’s the precise mechanism and time for any of the mental issues tied to childhood trauma?

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-12T20:08:13+00:00

Good to know. Some pro-trans orgs and people have tried to foist the label "non man" on female people against our wills. But it suits you much more than it does us.

I directly said that was an ugly term but whatever.

BTW, the sex binary isn't a creation of "society" - it's nature's doing. Moreover, the issue with gender identity is gender - which isn't binary. There are all kinds of ways for an individuals to be.

Treating everyone differently and separating everyone by sex is a creation of society. Gender isn’t just what you like. It’s identity.

There have always been guys who've been unconventional for their sex.

Good?

But only in recent years have such males begun using their lack of affinity for the sex stereotypes associated with their sex as an excuse to make fatuous claims that they are of the opposite sex and to demand that female people accommodate them by giving up our rights to self-definition, safety, privacy, dignity, fairness in sports - and to make it impossible for girls and women to ever be away from males even for a moment.

Define recently. Bottom surgery itself in 90 years old. And if you include non-binary identities like the Hijra literally thousands of years.

Also, it's really not true that "everything is split by sexes" at least not in the West any more. Historically, girls & women were excluded from many spheres of life because of our sex, but that's no longer the case. Just a few things are split by sex nowadays, and it's where sex really matters: sports, toilets, locker rooms, change rooms, health care, prisons, etc.

Bathrooms and changing rooms determine most of access to society. Health care determines whether we live or die and “trans broken arm syndrome” is very real. And putting trans women in men’s prison is basically guaranteeing they will be raped.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-12T20:03:10+00:00

I didn’t bring up racism. I don’t claim to be an authority on it.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-12T20:01:55+00:00

People using words different does mean their meaning changed. That’s how meanings change.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-12T19:37:26+00:00

It's not a matter of debate whether men who say they are "women" are, in fact, men.

It literally is. We are talking about it and disagreeing right now.

That is so because they have a male body and this is something that can be easily and objctively determined.

Which I don’t believe is what defines manhood.

Biology doesn't care about how said males feel about their sexed bodies or how much effort they put into concealling their sex.

We aren’t talking about biology, we are talking about social interactions or at least taxonomy. No one is disagreeing about who has what chromosomes. We are arguing about what that means for definitions. It’s semantics.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-12T19:34:53+00:00

And I don’t agree with your definition, as you know. Repeating it accomplishes nothing.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-12T19:34:22+00:00

Never said they could. I don’t deny I’m male. But that isn’t the question .

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-12T19:33:48+00:00

Anyway, don't you understand how offensive is it that you think women (the adult human females, you know) are perfectly comfortable and happy with the way we are treated by society and the way we are told we should be?

I never said you were. I said dysphoric tendency plus social messaging that you are wrong for liking the things you like as your sex equals core identity change and indullible trans identity. I didn’t say anything about anyone else.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-12T19:31:17+00:00

There is obviously a different way to use those words as they are used by trans people and trans inclusive people. You don’t need proof to know trans men call themselves men and trans women call themselves women. Since there is an entire group that uses it different than you then your argument based on only one definition is then a matter of definitional disagreement. It’s not a question of facts because No one believes any physical thing is different. You are disagreeing over definitions.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-12T19:29:03+00:00

I understand that perfectly well. Me specifically I imagine almost no one thinks of me as a “true” woman. Though I think that’s mostly to do with the fact that I look like an ogre.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-12T18:48:13+00:00

You are literally saying it was a disservice to save my life. Think about that.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-12T18:47:17+00:00

No one is debating what male and female are. We are talking past each other unsung different definitions for man or woman. This is definitionally a semantic argument.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-12T18:28:52+00:00

There’s no objective test or agreed categorization. This isn’t scientific. It’s a language question.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-12T18:28:09+00:00

You conflate gender and sex in a way that we don’t then use it as a language shell game.

Sex and gender aren’t the same. My sex is regrettably male. But my gender is in no way man.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-12T18:25:37+00:00

I actually wouldn’t mind that. If being “non-binary” wasn’t considered part man I could accept that. Non- man is a pretty ugly phrase but I’ve said before in a vaccum I wouldn’t need to be called a woman as long as I wasn’t called a man but we live in a binary society. Everything is split by sexes so you have to pick one and I’d rather be dead than a man so …

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-12T18:23:19+00:00

I never claimed to be fixed. I claimed to be non suicidal and functional as a result of transition. I’m not mentally healthy but the machine is running even if it’s a slapdash repair.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-12T18:22:04+00:00

And you know is disagree. It’s not a “fact” that I’m a man. Because I’m not one. We are literally debating it right now and there isn’t an agreed test. This is a semantic question not a factual one.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-12T18:20:41+00:00

There’s not some clean psychological developmental timeline.

Children lean to function in society by learning appropriate behavior in contexts and gender roles are pushed then. How is that controversial to you?

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-12T17:49:52+00:00

Take issue with me calling myself a woman if you must but I’m not a man. To say so would be a lie in every level. It would be like calling myself a cannibal. Both disgusting and untrue.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-12T17:47:27+00:00

Language changes based on society.

But back to the point. Without transition I would be dead. I was an actively suicidal no functional mess. Now I’m not suicidal and get by. In what way is that a disservice to me?

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-12T17:45:59+00:00

Are you saying the combination of you having dysphoria and also being pressured by male socialization that you rejected while you somehow absorbed female socialization is why you know you’re not a man/are a woman?

Growing up dysphoric effects the lens of the attempted socialization. Feeling alienated from the ideas pushed on you in a way most people don’t shapes the effects of that attempted socialization.

I wouldn’t say I have female socialization. But I don’t think it’s accurate to call me a man. Whether I am a woman is a point in open to discussing. It’s not that important to me personally. However not being a man is a point that I am dead set.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-12T17:42:16+00:00

You seem to think that growing up in a physical, sexed body in the material world surrounded by persons, animals and plants that also have sexed bodies has zero impact and influence on the psyches of developing children.

I’m making a distinction between the superficial and things that are too deep set to be flexible. I’m in fact directly saying we are influenced by outside experiences. But when they hit you effects how hard they hit you.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-12T17:40:20+00:00

I have no idea who that is.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-12T16:14:07+00:00

So you can’t change the harmful language you use to describe yourself to actual accurate language because you don’t have the psychological capacity to handle it, Not because the label is true?

I’m not actually sure what you are saying here. To be clear I don’t believe it would be accurate to call me a man.

But I wasn’t done a disservice. I mean sure there’s a psychological issue in play but transition still objectively improved my life.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-12T16:11:28+00:00

I’m not saying he wasn’t a racist I’m saying if he changed that racism wasn’t a core component of his personality.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-12T11:39:37+00:00

Is racism a core facet of their identity? Is religion? If it changes I would bet not.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-12T11:38:19+00:00

No, but there are structures in a Brain that make someone prone to dysphoria. I don’t think they are dispositive on their own.

Gender identity absolutely deals with the physical reality as experienced. I had to experience my body to feel it was wrong. And experience how the world treated me based on that body to know that was wrong.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-12T11:25:34+00:00

You are just talking about changing a superficial label, I’m talking about the psychological structures that make someone use a label. I know it is wrong to be called a man just as I know it would be wrong to called anything else that just isn’t true. Just as I know woman doesn’t feel wrong.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-12T11:14:37+00:00

Calling myself a man would Absolutely be lying for your benefit.

That label doesn’t fit. It would be as wrong as calling myself a chicken or a cat.

circlingmyownvoid2 · 2021-11-12T11:05:10+00:00

We are talking about formative childhood. Archetypes are how you function at that point.

So which is it? Do people with dysphoria who try to resolve their distress by developing or claiming to have an opposite-sex gender identity possess an innate sense of gendered self that they're born with and is hard-wired into their brain structures

I think it’s both. Like I think dysphoria has a biological root but it’s worsened by social pressures. But again I’m only speaking for dysphoric trans people though. I don’t want to dismiss non dysphorics but I also don’t get it.

circlingmyownvoid2