all 22 comments

[–]VioletRemi 9 insightful - 1 fun9 insightful - 0 fun10 insightful - 1 fun -  (16 children)

I was growing up as orthodox christian in USSR/post-USSR. I was not fanatic type, and family was mildly religious. However, when I ran away from home to other city and was homeless for a year, for few weeks I was sleeping in Church, so I've read full Bible (and surprisingly Quran, as they had big library). I found so many offensive to women and lesbians stuff there. That was the moment when I stopped being religious, as if they hate me and condemning to hell - why should I love them and follow their instructions if my placein hell anyways?

[–][deleted]  (1 child)


    [–]VioletRemi 6 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 0 fun7 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

    I did not even know what lesbian is and that it is possible to live with woman until i was 20 years old. And I had a lot of crushes on women since childhood, but did not know what to do with this.

    [–]SailorMoon2020 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (13 children)

    The Bible doesn't say anything about female homosexuality; it's all directed toward male sodomy, and the spilling of the seed (semen). I unsure of what lesbian offenses you mean; however, the offenses relating to women makes sense more so in the old testament.

    On another note, I'm guessing a lot of users here are international. I noticed every time I start a new day, majority of the post are posted during the night time (CDT).

    [–]VioletRemi 5 insightful - 4 fun5 insightful - 3 fun6 insightful - 4 fun -  (10 children)

    There are a bunch stuff about woman loving woman, but it is more of a minor sin, while man loving man is major sin or "death penalty". I think in Romans book there the most about it. It all is mostly in new books. In old books there nothing about woman, yeah. And in general books are written for men to read it, as there often "you" means man. But it wasn't that big of turn off, more turn off was how women were described both in Bible and Quran.

    For me it is similar - most posts are done when I am sleeping or at work (GMT+2).

    [–]SailorMoon2020 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (9 children)

    Do you mind pointing these passages? I've read the Bible since I was a kid and the only passage that some interpret to be that of women loving women is the passage where it states 'women shall not participate in unholy acts'. While some believe this to mean female homosexuality, others think it to mean beastiality. All in all, it's up for interpretation because the bible wasn't as frank with women as it is when it comes to the sex of a male.

    [–]VioletRemi 5 insightful - 3 fun5 insightful - 2 fun6 insightful - 3 fun -  (0 children)

    Sadly, I don't remember exactly. Maybe that was what you are saying, and priest just interpreted it that way.

    [–]VioletRemi 4 insightful - 3 fun4 insightful - 2 fun5 insightful - 3 fun -  (5 children)

    I found that book actually. And I think I know what the problem, there "man" translated as "human" in most places - so book is now aimed on everyone and not just men. So ofc when there was about homosexuality, I took it on myself as well. I am human, after all.

    [–]SailorMoon2020 1 insightful - 3 fun1 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 3 fun -  (4 children)

    I think that's where religions go wrong. The Bible was written as it was, and should not be touched either interpreting translations but literal translations. When God wanted to focus on women, he specifically said 'woman/women'.

    [–]VioletRemi 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

    It is still pretty wrong, at least from my perspective, as it almost never does this.

    [–]SailorMoon2020 1 insightful - 3 fun1 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 3 fun -  (2 children)

    I am unsure what you mean by this sentence. When you say, "it is still pretty wrong?" What is? The bible, the way women are treated? "As it almost never does" If you're talking about the bible and women in it, I whole heartedly disagree. The Bible spends numerous times speaking of women. What varies is the role of women during the old and new testament. As I mentioned to another user, God changes from passage to passage from testament to testament. He admits when he's wrong, he's willing to grow. When women are first introduced, the role is small, and focused on bearing children, pleasing the husband, but as the bible moves forward and God evolves has an entity, more and more break from these roles that once held them down. Have you read the bible? Or do you only know what others have taught you from the mouth of man? If you haven't read it, I highly suggest doing so and you will get your own point of view.

    [–]VioletRemi 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

    Reading was actually the problem.

    But everyone has their own perspective on things.

    [–]SailorMoon2020 1 insightful - 2 fun1 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

    Be weary of perspectives you hold which have no personal experience; history has shown it leads to ignorance, discrimination, and genocide. Either way, good talk!

    [–][deleted]  (1 child)


      [–]SailorMoon2020 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

      The Bible states the spilling of a male's seed if not for procreation is a sin. This is said to be one reason male homosexuality is a sin. Another is because in the literal translations, the males were men raping boys and angels. Regardless of interpretation, it is a sin as stated.

      I personally believe God is a changing God, one that changes with the times. This is evident in numerous situations that took place in the bible. One example is in the ancient Hebrew text of the Talmud, Adam's first wife was Lilth. She desired to be that of Adam's equal for she was made from the same clay. It was order she obey and submit to Adam.

      But later in Paul, he mentions no one is superior to that of another. No one is greater no subordinate to another. All is one with Christ regardless.

      Another is the intermixing of race interpreted in Levticus. Jews were to not inter-mingle with those outside them. This changed when Moses married Tzphorah. When Aaron and Mariam became upset. God punish them for their hostility.

      I feel God is no longer the wrathful entity he was and the Bible shows he changes and grows in his thinking as time passes from generation to generation. I see no reason why he wouldn't continue to change with the time. Besides, I and us were created in his image; he made no mistakes.

      [–]reluctant_commenter 2 insightful - 3 fun2 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 3 fun -  (0 children)

      Hahaha... or some of us are just up ridiculously late..

      [–][deleted]  (3 children)


        [–][deleted]  (2 children)


          [–][deleted]  (1 child)


            [–][deleted] 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

            I already have come to accept that there is a 99.9% chance of me getting disowned after I move out. I think a few of my siblings may be okay with me after a while but def not my parents. I just hate the thought of me coming out to them, so I might just write them a letter. I also like your Ted Bundy example lol.

            [–]votkriscan 6 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 0 fun7 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

            I did. From seven to college, which is basically my entire child/teenage hood, I attended Christian schools. Where I was though had a heavy scholastic focus, as there was a huge onus in the place to achieve educational results. There were definitely important things like prayers, worship, sermons and other Christian segments in class, but it's probably different from say, Christian schools in America or other places where distillation of doctrinal focus is more pertinent, and there might be heavy consistency on certain messages or even policing to ensure the focus comes across.

            However, this didn't effect me much as the city/country itself was socially conservative. So, even if my school wasn't religious you can't really be out or talk about being gay anyway.

            [–]carrotcake 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (4 children)

            I was in catholic schools from four to twelve years old so not during my teenage years but during my whole childhood. I also always said that i wouldn't ever get married but no one thought that was strange. My parents aren't super strict nor super religious so I'm not in your shoes but from the stories i have heard from my friends and even from talking with my therapist, usually religious parents deal way worse with gay kids when they find out while they are still teenagers/living at home. So it's probably better to keep that to yourself until you move out. Just for the sake of your safety. As for what you should do to help your mental health: is it possible for you to see a therapist? If not, do you have lgbt friends with whom you can be yourself and talk about your problems and fears? Do you live in a big enough city for you to look for lgbt support groups and become a member without your parents finding out through gossip? What i have experienced is that it isn't so damaging mental health wise to hide your sexuality at home if you are able to be yourself with friends or somewhere else. But it's different for everybody so i could be wrong. Be safe, good luck.

            [–][deleted]  (3 children)


              [–]carrotcake 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

              Maybe wearing abaya+hijab wouldn't be a problem to some members of a lgbt support group, but definitely that would make you more recognizable.

              I'm probably going too far here but the only thing i can think of is maybe if you wear "stylish muslim" clothes people will be less islamophobic with you and maybe even think you may be a pro-gay hijabi just by looking at you? Idk if that makes sense and i don't have any real life example to give you but that's kind of the feeling that i get from some people I've seen in media. I'm thinking ayana from project runway but probably a reference you won't recognize. Also there's this girl that i saw in a YouTube video the other day, she also has this stylish looking modest clothes. My guess is that this probably can make western people think you are "cool". Idk (link to the video:

              Edit: probably that's too much work though. Maybe it's better for you to wait to move out, since you don't sound so far from it being a possibility.

              [–][deleted]  (1 child)


                [–]carrotcake 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

                I hope you can stop wearing your hijab soon. And yeah what you said about the guy at school makes sense. Also really it wasn't great for him to say that in front of your class. People can be jerks sometimes.

                [–]Fuckyoucensorship 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

                I mean I don't know if in islam you wait for marriage to have sex but I had taken a pledge for purity back in middleschool because I was christian and purity is important.

                After I realized I was into women I just kept being vocal about my purity. People didn't discuss sex things with me because they figured I wouldn't get it. Half way though I started being masculine again and it was pretty much a don't ask don't tell secret where we all pretended I was straight but we all independently knew I wasn't.

                [–][deleted] 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

                Yeah the purity thing is a big thing amongst muslims too. Maybe Ill just be gay openly in my private life and just never really mention it to my family, and let them assume what they want about me and my hypothetical "friend". The other part of me just wants to be honest so idk.

                [–]lmaonope333 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

                i can relate. i grew up ultra orthodox jewish, i went to a religious all girls school, and I was closeted until 18