Have you personally lost friends or community due to the trans issue, or a trans ideologue more directly?

submitted by ReconNinja from self.TumblrInAction

I don't know how this subsaidit feels about more personally-oriented posts, but this has been weighing on me for years and I have nowhere else I can express it. I've never seen another social or political issue with such propensity to tear people and communities apart so rapidly (people who otherwise would, or for a long time did, get along famously). At least in today's cultural milieu where religiosity is on a gradual decline, it tends to be even more readily divisive than religion; This can be said about the current wave of leftist identitarianism in general, but the trans issue is the pinnacle thereof. It's an issue that should only be of chief concern to a tiny segment of the population, but it has rapidly become one of the first purity tests people employ to determine if destroying relationships, stripping you of a cherished community (possibly by destroying it outright), or vindictively endeavoring to ruin other aspects of your life is warranted. I shouldn't have to worry to such an inordinate degree about losing anything or anyone else I care about on account of the delusional zealotry of a tiny demographic fringe (or "allies" who believe that uncritically championing them is the ultimate demonstration of morality) that I don't even know where to attempt to find true friends anymore. I shouldn't have to be posting this on an obscure Reddit knockoff because conceited trans dogmatists get their grubby hands on every social media moderation position they possibly can. Dissent to their ideas and behavior shouldn't be so thoroughly suppressed that the only significantly visible opposition to it comes from other corners of ideological insanity.

To answer my own question, I was in a group chat formed from the Facebook fan group of a niche podcast for three years. They were absolutely perfect people for me; We all saw eye to eye and we could all post anything we felt like, be it about personal interests, edgy jokes (or in my case, the sadomasochistic spreading of cringey fetish art. Yes, I'm an evil bastard 😁), political rants, playful jabs, or rnh serious emotional struggles. I got to meet one of them in person once and it was the best day of that year. Hell, this group was even directly responsible for orchestrating the loss of my virginity, something I once thought might never happen since I had spent so long under the socially stunting thumb of my fundamentalist religious family. I knew I felt a sea change when a member who had been dormant since the group's inception suddenly started posting, and some of his first interactions were to come out as trans, repeatedly fish for assent to his reality denial, hate on his father, whine about how getting a job is too overwhelming to attempt, all the shit you can find on this subsaidit in abundance. I guess this guy had some kind of charisma that I just don't understand, because in a matter of months the tenor of the group shifted to something I didn't recognize. I frequently had to sit out of conversations I bore no relation to anymore, and on occasion the trans member directly repudiated me when I discussed my own issues (which I could've comfortably spoken in the past, and which I explicitly stated were not intended to invalidate anyone else), and it eventually reached the point where I just had to admit my friends were lost and see myself out. I could've (maybe should've) taken a page out of his playbook and kicked him out of the community the moment I felt like things were going a direction I didn't like, but I hate conflict, I don't enjoy controlling people, I know how bad it feels to be alienated from or kicked out of a community you care about, and I foolishly assumed that narcissists can tolerate people different from them. I will not make that mistake again.

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[–]jacques1102 11 insightful - 1 fun11 insightful - 0 fun12 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

I personally have never lost friends to the trans issues, but i know for a fact that if i stated my opinions on a few friends of mine that i'd lose them.The problem is that it's difficult for me to ask a lot without walking on egg shells to try and not "offend" anyone.So i just try to avoid it and on the off chance it does pop up,i usually try to talk to the friends who don't agree with this ideology.

[–]thethrowawayReddit refugee 8 insightful - 1 fun8 insightful - 0 fun9 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Thats exactly where Im at. My roommate (who is also my ex gf) is trans and I just keep my opinions to myself and dont talk about trans subjects to her. Honestly shes never pushed her opinions and shes a genuinely kind person otherwise so I respect the "they" pronouns she wants when talking to her.

But yeah if I were open about my opinions Id lose 2/3rds of my friends.

[–]FlyingKangaroo 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I also prefer to talk to friends who I know wouldn’t support it. I’m lucky to live in a country where the trans thing isn’t generally supported, although it changed with younger generations and I’m a bit afraid about it. Mostly it’s that I would either avoid that topic if it’s possible or when it pops up, I’d try to politely say I am skeptical or against it.

Only this week I (voluntarily) started a discussion with a few younger students from a queer organization. I tried to show them my arguments why the trans identities cover up real problems. I think it went well (that I wasn’t as stressed out as I expected) but of course they didn’t understand anything and only kept using their “flawless” arguments. At least I met three girls who all said they were nonbinary and one of them outright said she dislikes her body.

Could be worse had I lived in a country where I’d be arrested for that. But I wouldn’t stop for sure.

[–]thethrowawayReddit refugee 8 insightful - 1 fun8 insightful - 0 fun9 insightful - 1 fun -  (6 children)

Not exactly. I have never cut anyone out of my life because of them being trans or pushing the movement too much, but I do feel discluded when one friend group I'm in talks about trans issues. Im probably the only one of the 6 of us that believes you are your biological gender and any amount of surgery and hormones will not change that. Anyway I just go quiet when the topic comes up and I think they take the hint.

Sorry I got off track, to answer your question, I was about to get engaged to a girl (I already had bought a ring, we knew each other for 7 yrs at the time) when she broke up with me out of the blue because she needed to find herself. I took it pretty rough but ultimately dated someone else and got over her. She reconnected with me ~1 year later and said she is now "nonbinary" and getting a name change and everything. Well I was dating another girl at the time and I had no idea about trans stuff so I supported my ex.

Couple months later my gf and I broke up and I started talking to my ex more, she said she wants to try again with me and I said I dont know about the trans thing and Ill have to look into that first and see if its right for me. Well the more I looked at the community the more I was horrified by what I saw. I eventually found r/tumblrinacrion and I found plenty of people who agreed with me. I told my ex I wasnt comfortable dating a trans person (she took it ok) but we can remain friends.

So while we are still good friends, I would be married to this girl with children by now if it werent for trans stuff.

[–]Femaleisnthateful 9 insightful - 1 fun9 insightful - 0 fun10 insightful - 1 fun -  (4 children)

So while we are still good friends, I would be married to this girl with children by now if it werent for trans stuff.

It's sad to think how many young people are screwing themselves out of fulfilling lives and relationships because of their unhealthy fixation on gender. Do you have any sense of what's driving her gender identity?

[–]thethrowawayReddit refugee 6 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 0 fun7 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

I do

Body dysmorphia, she was never comfortable with her chest. Its strange because before the trans stuff became mainstream, she was "okay" with it enough that it wasnt causing much of an issue.

It was only after she found out about trans stuff and started to identify as nonbinary that she became super self conscious about her chest and started being unable to shower or change without having a mental breakdown - which seemed like a huge backwards step to me. She uses the metaphor "its like noticing a pebble in your shoe, once you notice it itll bug you forever". So why push an ideology that makes young people less comfortable with their bodies and not more??

[–]INeedSomeTime 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

Self-fullfilling prophecy in a way. Once you consider you may be transgender suddenly you try to confirm it. It's just so interesting to me how someone, who was all comfortable with themselves, suddenly get so miserable once they consider they may be trans.

[–]Airbus320 1 insightful - 2 fun1 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

Mm

[–]VulptexMy pronouns are the/matrix 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

A lot of women have issues with their breasts for other reasons, like sexual trauma. Not being 100% happy with every aspect of your sex doesn't make you trans. Now if you despise every aspect of it, then it's a different matter. But most trans stuff is just normal complaints or internalized dislike of your own gender for other reasons.

[–]VulptexMy pronouns are the/matrix 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

If she took it okay she's almost certainly not part of that toxic community. Probably just confused.

[–]jet199 6 insightful - 2 fun6 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 2 fun -  (1 child)

No. Everyone in real life I've discussed this stuff with has eventually come round to my way of thinking. However I never bring it up first and I don't talk about it on social media under my own name because it might cost me jobs.

[–]Femaleisnthateful 7 insightful - 2 fun7 insightful - 1 fun8 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

Same. During COVID, when everyone at my workplace started putting pronouns in their signatures, I felt like I was in Invasion of the Body Snatchers. Since returning to the office, I've been pleasantly surprised to find out how many people have decided this is all bullshit. Even the pronoun people are doing it mostly out of indifference or concern for optics.

That said, I live in Canada, and I'm very careful about how and with whom I talk to about this stuff. I don't have a social media presence other than here.

[–]FlyingKangaroo 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Yes, there were irl friends (of course later I realized they were never as good friends as I thought, lol). What’s unusual, we met at school. At first I only perceived them as girls, which they are, but some months later I learned the first one is FTM. Later, in another school, her social transition went so far she was using a different name and pronouns at school. Always had a more masculine style but it was accelerated in the next school, with the hairstyle and even different clothing.

In the span of few years the second girl came out as bi, then came out as pan and later (or circa pansexual coming out?) as nonbinary. In her case it involved a new fake name but only used among friends and sometimes online and silly neutral-sounding pronouns (our first language isn’t English so it all sounds even stupider than they/them).

Around year or two year after the second one’s NB coming out we all fell out, they both suddenly cut contact with me and only left a message saying how much of a bigot, prude and hater I am. That all being said when I was (sadly) supportive of their identities and never mocked them for that; however they knew they both were further than me into the gender shit, for example there were some queer things I would never accept (like related to children or being against kink at pride).

I was a bit angry and sad it happened since I didn’t mean bad for them but overall I became happier. Later I realized it’s actually better that way for me, to not be burdened with their traumas or irritating behavior. But most importantly - I realized how evil this stuff is. Perhaps I was lucky never meeting MTF too, I feel most FTMs and female enbies are more tame and less predatory.

There were also a few online acquaintances (all women again) who trooned out. We also lost contact but I wouldn’t say it was directly due to the trans thing. I say this because with some I drifted apart before they came out. Only later I encountered their profiles online again and saw how they changed. Almost all were trans men now, one nonbinary (but striving for a more transmasc style than the real-life ex-friend I had). In one case, I distanced from one female artist I knew online when we argued over something (she was overreacting over me noticing she was mean to someone else) and we didn’t talk much later (even though the matter was explained). However, one day I saw she now uses a male name and male pronouns, so I went to unfollow and block her, as this disgusted me. I must admit she was a fujoshi, though never I would expect her trooning out; I wonder if there was any childhood trauma involved. Once she had some girlfriend I think, after trooning out started a relationship with another woman art creator who’s a trans man too. I know they’re getting hormonal therapy currently. Cursed things.

Additional fact: the first ever trans person I ever known, that girl from school who was FTM, now uses even a different male name online (with a different surname, Asian-like). I figured out she might be hanging with some older man, that sounds weird. A sugar daddy? Tranny chaser? Who knows.

[–]Wanderingthehalls 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I haven't lost any friends yet but I absolutely would lose a lot if they knew how I really felt. Many of my friends from my favourite hobby group, most of my 'mom friends' and a lot of my friends from my 20s are all quite TRAish. I have developed ways of bringing it up in a 'test the waters' kind of way and I have found at least a couple of friends who feel similar to me.

I wouldn't mind too much if I lost the old friends or the 'mom' friends as my kid is old enough now that he has his own friends rather than being close to the kids of my friends. I'd be sad but day to day my life would be fine. But I really wouldn't like it to cause problems with my hobby as that's a sport I practice several times a week and I'm not willing to lose the happiness it brings me or cause issues for my kid who also plays. I'm also at a point of restarting work after taking time out to be a stay at home mother and I know if I was public about my feelings that would limit my options drastically in the field I'm aiming to get into.

[–]YJaewedwqewq 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Not personally, but some of my friends have. I have typically avoided people who support such things but I've seen it ruin plenty of friend groups and ruin multiple people's lives (or set them on a course for life ruination, leastwise). Some friends of friends had fallings out or other drama occur due to tranny troubles.

[–]Tums_is_Smut_bkwrds 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I haven't lost any yet, but I purposely police my speech so that I don't alienate friends and family. This includes talking about niggers or Jews. A couple people I know would (and have) escalate to a heated discussion and it would not go well, but I don't know where most people really stand and I'm not about to start asking them what they think about the faggots teaching our kids, or violent niggers, or dirty Jews.

Having to edit myself constantly used to be exhausting but now I'm used to it. That's a terrible thing BTW but hey it's the reality. And it is abundantly clear that if you actually try to practice 'Free Speech' today you are going to end up in a world of hurt. There's no point on dying on that hill for no good result; pick your battles. And keep you fucking eyes open for any and all opportunities to turn things around. Just because we're quiet it doesn't mean we have given in.

[–]JerzyZulawski 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Every online forum and community I was part of got torn apart by, got shut down because of, or became unusable because of culture wars bullshit. Not specifically trans stuff, but that was part of it.

[–]RedEyedWarriorThe Evil Cishomo 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I avoid the trans issue as much as I can. Only myad and my best mate know my stance on transgenderism. I keep everybody else in the dark on purpose because I don't want to lose friends or family.

My dad and I both recognise that transgenderism is bullshit. My mam is against non-binary identities, against hate speech laws and against transing children. However she believes that transgender people should have a right to get sex changes, and she was furious when she found out Trump banned trans people from the military- then again, my mother has Trump derangement syndrome, which is incredibly common among middle class women in my country. My mother was shocked when I told her I would never date a trans man, but she respects my decision. While she is critical of transgender ideology, she also defends transgender people. So she wouldn't be pleased if she knew my entire stance on the matter.

My brother and sister are big supporters of transgenderism. My sister has a friend who is trans. She would yell at me or disown me if she knew my stance. My brother is a leftist who goes along with leftist narratives, and thinks that it's hypocritical for gay people to oppose transgenderism. So I avoid the topic completely.

My work colleagues don't know my stance. Thankfully they don't seem to take the trans issue seriously. I know it's not wise to talk about sensitive topics in the workplace.

My best friend shares my stance on transgenderism. Which is a huge relief.

[–]INeedSomeTime 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I only expect to certainly lose friends I have if I shared my actual views on the current trans issue. It's not all negative towards trans people themselves. I'd say I hold a nuanced view on it where I differentiate between people, who you could call "genuinely trans" with severe gender dysphoria resistant to any interventions than just transitioning. But I cannot treat "trans/non-binary" people who have no dysphoria or just social dysphoria (which to me is very fucking normal) seriously and I find indulging their "identity" as actually harmful. So it pains me to have a friend with "they" pronouns and refer to her as such. I hate to indulge someone in avoidance of an issue she should face - sexism, misogyny etc. and pretend somehow she is suddenly above these once she declared having "they" pronouns. Today's trans activists claim how transgender is not mental illness but to me transgender identification (which is not caused by actual clinical gender dysphoria) can induce it. This is why I feel strong uneasiness with indulging proclaimed non-binary people or non-binary characters, which are being made nowadays. I view them as confused, disturbed people, who use depersonalization from their gender as unhealthy coping mechanism.