all 18 comments

[–]MyLongestJourney 12 insightful - 2 fun12 insightful - 1 fun13 insightful - 2 fun -  (7 children)

I do not see any lesbophobia and I belong to the lesbian-repulsed-by-dick category. Care to explain why is it lesbophobic to point out that some lesbians are not repulsed by dick ,it just does nothing for them sexually?

[–]jay-dayGold Star Gay Woman[S] 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (6 children)

The two commenters said lesbians can be ok with sleeping with men, which no, lesbians aren't ok with sleeping with men. All lesbians are not attracted to men. It's simple. The fact I have to type this out twice in the span of a couple of minutes shows me this is a bigger problem that I originally thought.

[–]hufflepuff-poet 12 insightful - 1 fun12 insightful - 0 fun13 insightful - 1 fun -  (4 children)

I think part of the problem is for women, especially lesbians, it can be hard to understand what attraction is until you've felt it and named it in your own body. Otherwise it's easy to think you're just not attracted to these men but could be "attracted to/tolerate" some hypothetical man. For some people, attraction can't be understood until it's lived in the body with another person. I think alot of lesbians aren't 100% confident in their sexuality until they've been with a woman and finally understand that "this is what attraction is and how it feels in my body".

[–]Athelhilda4Questioning 11 insightful - 1 fun11 insightful - 0 fun12 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

I’ve never thought of it this way, and I agree. Sometimes I feel that the born this way narrative and the stories of gay people who knew they were gay at six year olds has created a culture where late bloomers are met with suspicion. Not everyone has a strong sex drive with obvious attraction. For some people, their attraction to the same sex is a whisper that they’re capable of ignoring or dismissing as something else.

[–]hufflepuff-poet 8 insightful - 1 fun8 insightful - 0 fun9 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

This. Heterosexuals are allowed to explore their sexuality without being any less straight. A straight man can hookup with another man or a straight woman can have sex with a woman and when they say it's not their thing and they're actually straight, everyone believes them and moves on. Even gay men are given that freedom to some extent yet if a lesbian has ever been with a man, no matter how long ago or how much she expresses regret or says she didn't enjoy it, she's viewed as tainted and not really a lesbian--despite lesbianism being the most doubted and erased of the monosexual orientations.

Sexuality is a journey that begins in adolescence and continues into adulthood; one of the foundational steps in that journey is accepting one's sexual orientation. Heterosexuality is assumed for everyone, so they are given more freedom but LGBs have to first reject heterosexuality for themselves before they can correctly label their orientation. Many of us find clues to our orientation in hindsight looking back at our feelings as children and teens but not everyone has the answer right away. Not every child or teen experiences attraction or has the tools to name it as such, even in hindsight. I wish we lived in a world where adolescents had more freedom to explore without needing to label themselves and more of a coming of age ritual centered around "coming out" as LGB or Straight after your first serious relationship or another big life event revolving around sexual and romantic experiences. I think it would help with all the confusion so many young folks have around their sexuality.

[–]jay-dayGold Star Gay Woman[S] 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

It just sounds like those are bisexuals again. This just reminds me of homophobes telling lesbians to sleep with both men and women to be a 100% sure. Even if they never had a crush on a woman, the lack of attraction, being uninterested, and the discomfort with men should be present. If they've been interested, attracted, and/or comfortable dating and sleeping with men, they're bi, but they may prefer women.

[–]Athelhilda4Questioning 15 insightful - 1 fun15 insightful - 0 fun16 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

You can have sex with people you aren’t sexually attracted to. From personal experience, I can tell you that it is a horrible experience for both participants, but it can and does happen. I’ve noticed that men previously married to women are accepted as having always been gay, but never women.

[–]MyLongestJourney 9 insightful - 1 fun9 insightful - 0 fun10 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

They did not say that.

[–]hufflepuff-poet 12 insightful - 1 fun12 insightful - 0 fun13 insightful - 1 fun -  (4 children)

Not sure if I view this as Lesbophobia. I've had a few lesbian friends irl express similar sentiments to femlez34-- that they could "grin and bear kissing/sex/intimacy" with a man or that they'd be willing to suck dick if they were drunk (this struck me as some weird self-harm kind of thing tbh 🥴🤯😒), but they're not actually attracted to him. I've always thought it was weird but most of my friends who expressed those feelings were younger lesbians in their early 20s, still figuring out that it's ok to be a woman who wants nothing to do with men sexually or romantically and it's ok to only desire women and to pursue those desires. I see it as a response to the overwhelming expectations that women must want a man, even lesbians. Now that I've typed this out, I guess it is Lesbophobia, internalized.

I personally have never been able to relate to this mindset because for me, I realized I didn't enjoy being with men before I was able to accept that I did desire women. I never felt right being w men but I thought it was something wrong w me and I had to get over it. But the more I tried, the worse I felt and the more dissociated I felt til I just stopped having sex/dating at all for a few years cus it made me feel so disgusting being with men. I never really let myself acknowledge my attraction to women because I thought it was wrong and weird and made me feel like a creep around other women. Once I kissed a woman and especially after I had sex with a woman, there was no going back. I could never be with a man, now that I know what sex and intimacy feels like when I'm with a person of the right sex, ie a woman. Even with women I'm not in love with, the sex is amazing and my body is responsive and awake and glad to be alive, not numb and tense and disgusted.

[–]jay-dayGold Star Gay Woman[S] 6 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 0 fun7 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

with a man or that they'd be willing to suck dick if they were drunk

Yeah, no. That's not what lesbians do or would be fine with. Your friends are just lesbophobic, and aren't lesbians. *It's also horrible they're saying stuff like that. It's a big reason why men harass lesbians. We give way too much lenience to lesbophobic women. I hate that this is so common, and so many of us just let it slide, it's partly why we're in this mess of erasure.

Maybe it's just me, but I've never had any doubt, even just the thought makes me uncomfortable and disgusted.

[–]hufflepuff-poet 11 insightful - 1 fun11 insightful - 0 fun12 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

Usually I'd agree that they're not lesbians but this was in college and the women I'm thinking of now have changed their tunes and wouldn't be with a man because it disgusts them, they were newly out and hadn't been with women yet. I think they just had to grow up and get more comfortable with themselves and their sexuality to admit that they only wanted women and not hide behind playing at heterosexuality.

I think lesbians have so much pressure to "try men out and give him a chance" (all women deal with that pressure, it's just even worse for lesbians cus there is no right guy for us and never will be) it can take awhile to reject that bullshit and accept yourself. There's a reason so many lesbians come out later than gay men, we aren't really given space to figure out our desires and what feels good vs what doesn't. I try to give younger lesbians grace in their coming out journey and not shut them down, though I do always tell them lesbians don't do dick and we shouldn't be expected to.

It's cool that you've never had any doubt! I admire that so much in other lesbians, that confidence is rare and getting rarer among Gen Z lesbians. How long have you been out?

[–]jay-dayGold Star Gay Woman[S] 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

I don't think pressure from society will make lesbians say or do stuff like that. Your friends just seem like their bi. I really think we need to stop letting this stuff slide, experiencing homophobia doesn't mean they can be homophobic. When we let this stuff slide they just continue it. They were in college so they were adults, they had all that time to figure it out.

I've been out since 15, never was attracted to or was comfortable with the idea of being with men before that, never been attracted to men or have been comfortable with the idea of being with men afterwards. I didn't need to figure out I didn't like them, it's just how I've always felt.

[–]Athelhilda4Questioning 12 insightful - 2 fun12 insightful - 1 fun13 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

I’m pretty sure bisexual women don’t lay back and think of England while having sex with a man, aren’t disgusted by penis, don’t have to get black out drunk in order to go through with sleeping with a man, or disassociate from being with a man.

[–]IridescentAnacondastrictly dickly 8 insightful - 1 fun8 insightful - 0 fun9 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I'm in the "having sex with a chair" camp: I'm not at all repulsed by women's bodies, and in fact I find them aesthetically beautiful in the sense that the healthy human form is a beautiful thing. But I don't get any sexual charge from women.

[–]jay-dayGold Star Gay Woman[S] 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

[–]jay-dayGold Star Gay Woman[S] 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Platypus is openly bisexual. Femlez34 is a "lesbian" but has said things that suggest otherwise, talks about her ex-boyfriend often, seems to be a political "lesbian."

Based on their comment history.

[–]jay-dayGold Star Gay Woman[S] 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

[–]automoderatorHuman-Exclusionary Radical Overlord[M] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)


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