DiscussionI don't know

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[–]Retardation_station 25 insightful - 1 fun25 insightful - 0 fun26 insightful - 1 fun -  (11 children)

The only surefire way I've ever seen to deal with these people is a decisive "No.".

There will be fallout and depending on how deep you're in, it will likely cost you something. But weathering the storm is the only way out at this point.

Capitulation does not work. Bending your principles does not work. Retreat does not work.

Unless you draw a line in the sand they will not stop until they get what they want from you before throwing you in the garbage and moving on like locusts. Do not back down or they'll drive you to the cliffs.

[–]xanditAGAB (Assigned Gay at Birth) 16 insightful - 1 fun16 insightful - 0 fun17 insightful - 1 fun -  (8 children)

I hope you're training yourselves to speak and write in a proper manner

Nope.

if the situation get really badly out of control.

They are telling us sex is a construct and homosexuality is a fetish, how much worse can it get?

So try to be smart about what you're posting here, and how you're doing it, and why. Try as the best as you can to be reasonable.

Reasonable to who? The people who hate us? Wanna punch us?

Blaming the kids with "blue hair and ugly clothes" won't do any of you any good.

Sjw’s are the reason we are in this mess. They amplifed the queer theory gender nonsense into a pseudoscience.

I truly suggest you to try and see how you can be more revelant, less insulting

You can ask jk Rowling about whose side is more insulting.

This place became a collection of everything TQ does wrong, instead of focusing how WE could do things right as LGB people.

What should we be doing? The people at Lgb alliance tried to be heard for a year before they had to break off from stonewall. Tra’s don’t want to listen, they want us to conform to their beliefs. So what do you suggest besides “being reasonable” whatever that means?

[–]reluctant_commenter 11 insightful - 1 fun11 insightful - 0 fun12 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

My response was somewhat different than yours but I really appreciate yours. The elements you pointed out are important pieces of context, which OP's post glossed over.

[–]yousaythosethingsFind and Replace "gatekeeping" with "having boundaries" 16 insightful - 1 fun16 insightful - 0 fun17 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

I can sympathize with your perspective but I have been with this community since we got kicked off Reddit last July. I was in the middle of typing a comment on that sub. I went to submit the comment and learned it was banned. I had found the sub at the beginning of 2020 and it was an oasis of sanity for me, someone who had not been out for that long and peaked through the process of coming out as an adult and looking for resources to help me and coming head to head with disorienting and aggressive gender identity ideology everywhere I looked.

This included my real-life experience of trying to get an in-community therapist while I struggled with the coming out process. I was connected with a “lesbian” therapist I was told could relate to me, who very clearly was a heterosexual male “transbian.” That experience helped me realize a lot of the issues going on. The words “female” and “lesbian” suddenly had no clear meaning. I was left in a position where I realized I couldn’t say, “no, I want an actual woman” or “this person is obviously biologically male and therefore not a lesbian/a woman/like me.” Yet I was a paying customer and this was a service meant to help me, not validate his internal feelings of himself. It was like this in online forums too including all over Reddit. It felt weird to see people just going along with it. When it came to looking for practical information about lesbian sex, Google searches would render porn or guides that were focused on convincing women that of course males and male anatomy were included on lesbian sex, while I wondered if that’s the case how the hell does any girl or woman realize they’re gay? Female anatomy had everything to do with that for me. It was kind of notable that I wanted to eat pussy and that male anatomy did nothing for me. Also no comment anywhere from any LGBTQ orgs about the pornificaition of the word “lesbian.” How even “LGBTQ” orgs treated “lesbian” like a dirty word.

In those lesbian sex resources, I would be deluged by statements about penises not being “male”, “feminine penises,” and “girldick.” That “trans women are biological females.” That because “trans women are women” and “lesbians are women that are attracted to women” that “lesbians are attracted to trans women unless they’re bigots.” I was told directly that it wasn’t possible for me to be a lesbian and not be attracted to trans women because you never know someone’s biological sex and “trans women” can be completely indistinguishable from biological women. So I was either lying out of bigotry or ignorant about my existing attraction to trans-identifying males. Oh yea, and that males who identify as women have no obligation to disclose they are male to me and have every right to assume themselves into my dating pool (and they were alllll over my dating apps).

You know what all of this is? Traumatizing. It made me question my worldview on everything. I lost so much when I came out as gay. I lost what little family support I had. I lost my marriage to my best friend. I lost his family. And I did not have the community support that everyone assumed I had. I felt and still do feel like I’m in an abusive relationship with whatever purports to be the “LGBTQ community.”

This community is not perfect, but it was the only community I found. There is some trauma-bonding going on here. But we are far more civil, and with a few exceptions (especially the ban-evading), more reserved than the TRAs.

I personally want to focus less on the musings of lunatic randos, though the reactions and validation they receive tend to be the telling part. I am burned out, and want to focus my energy into something more productive. But I’m not going to judge those who need to vent here for their own sanity and in dealing with this traumatic experience. We all need this at times. And where else can you say any of this, no matter how nice you try to sound and how much you mutilate language in trying to convey basic thoughts that were uncontroversial 6 years ago?

[–]reluctant_commenter 7 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 0 fun8 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I felt and still do feel like I’m in an abusive relationship with whatever purports to be the “LGBTQ community.”

I feel that so hard. You really have a gift for putting words to reality.

I didn't realize you had this experience, with a MtF "lesbian" therapist who was essentially an identity tourist in a vulnerable minority demographic you were just realizing you were a part of. I'm so sorry you were put in that position, it sounds like being in one of those dreams/nightmares where nothing makes sense.

This community is not perfect, but it was the only community I found. There is some trauma-bonding going on here. But we are far more civil, and with a few exceptions (especially the ban-evading), more reserved than the TRAs.

Completely agree.

[–]endless_assfluff 15 insightful - 1 fun15 insightful - 0 fun16 insightful - 1 fun -  (22 children)

While I've talked about emotionally intelligent discussion strategies in the past and agree that we could spend more time strategizing, changing our behavior in a casual setting like this to center the needs of people outside the group comes with its own problems. There's something to be said for a space where people are allowed to vent.

Put more clearly, if you say "UUUGH, men are trash," and a friend responds "aCKShelLy you shouldn't say that because not all men," that doesn't mean the friend is more logical, knowledgeable, or level-headed, just that they lack empathy/emotional awareness to some degree. That is, in context, the purpose of the statement was to communicate that something distressing happened to you and you wanted to talk about it, not to literally write off half the population as buffoons. Regardless of whether the friend in this case is 'correct,' it's clear that anyone starting a conversation like that wants the other party to listen and validate their emotions. And instead they get lectured. The natural response to that is to feel hurt or defensive, since the aggrieved party is being told they don't deserve emotional support unless they communicate their problem in the 'right' way, something that takes loads of maturity and practice to do. That's why people will respond poorly to someone coming into a space where they're venting and telling them they can't do that anymore.

The best solution would be having a separate, less trauma-driven space reserved for talking strategy and rhetoric. Unfortunately, all the specialized academics I know working on this problem are radical feminists, so they wouldn't be welcome. (I'm also not interested in the reasons why you want to distance from GC/radical feminism. Please don't waste time explaining it to me.)

[–]oofreesouloo⚡super lesbian⚡ 6 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 0 fun7 insightful - 1 fun -  (9 children)

Omg, I hope this isn't awkward but you're amazing. I'm sure that the person you are dating or will date will be a very lucky one. You have an incredibly good emotional intelligence and empathy. Something that I, unfortunately, don't see that much. I watch several truly good people but who struggle to understand where others are coming from. Like you say, it's hard to communicate your problem in the 'right' way so people misunderstood it. Unless you're intelligent emotionally enough to understand the nuances and reasons behind it. You're amazing.

[–]endless_assfluff 7 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 0 fun8 insightful - 1 fun -  (8 children)

Why, you're too kind! I spend a lot of time working on those things, and hope to encourage others to do the same :) And thank you for this comment. It's draining to have discussions online where aggression/combativeness is the norm, and positive interactions and positive feedback mean the world to me.

[–]oofreesouloo⚡super lesbian⚡ 7 insightful - 7 fun7 insightful - 6 fun8 insightful - 7 fun -  (7 children)

I ended up looking at your comments (sorry 🙈) and realised you're a mathematician. I swear to God, if I met you I would have a massive crush on you, as this is anonymous I don't care to be blunt lmao, but I love nerdy woman, and you're intelligent in all the possible ways! You're literally "wife" material I swear to God 😱 You just captivated sorry lmao, with just one comment from this post you made me curious and searched for more and I ended up being even more captivated 😂 sorry if this is very awkward once again, I just was astonished with you, I've had massive crushes on nerdy women like you before, they're my weakness. Have a great day!

[–]Elvira95Viva la figa 7 insightful - 8 fun7 insightful - 7 fun8 insightful - 8 fun -  (4 children)

https://imgur.com/gallery/pe79EIR

[–]oofreesouloo⚡super lesbian⚡ 4 insightful - 4 fun4 insightful - 3 fun5 insightful - 4 fun -  (1 child)

I'm not horny haha, some women are just captivating. But they sure could make me horny 🤫🙊

[–]Elvira95Viva la figa 7 insightful - 5 fun7 insightful - 4 fun8 insightful - 5 fun -  (0 children)

Yeah, nerdy women are nice, especially if they're introverted and into videogames. 10/10.

[–]reluctant_commenter 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

Do you mind if I post this on s/LGBmemes? Made me laugh. I could think of an unrelated title, lol.

[–]Elvira95Viva la figa 6 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 0 fun7 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Sure can you that. It isn't like I made it myself ahah

[–]endless_assfluff 6 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 0 fun7 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

LMAO, you're making my day! I'll say this: at least someone else is getting something out of the random-ass comments.

[–]oofreesouloo⚡super lesbian⚡ 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

You're welcome ;)

[–]fuck_reddit 9 insightful - 1 fun9 insightful - 0 fun10 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

I’m already operating under the assumption that I will be thrown in the gulags unless things change soon and radically. That ship sailed long ago for me. On a different note, my ideas are rational, however, I choose mockery and derision because I haven’t met a leftist that accepts reason. Reason cannot overthrow ideas derived irrationally, humor can.

[–]Cass 8 insightful - 1 fun8 insightful - 0 fun9 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

Bisexual allies

????

You engaged in wrongspeak by excluding the bisexuals and demoting them to "allies".

[–]reluctant_commenter 8 insightful - 1 fun8 insightful - 0 fun9 insightful - 1 fun -  (10 children)

The amount of diplomacy that will be needed from LG people is tremendous and I hope all of you are ready for that. I hope you're training yourselves to speak and write in a proper manner (in your own mother-langage or/and in english) to express how you see the situation and how it appears as a difficult problem, because people will have no mercy whatsoever if the situation get really badly out of control.

Damn right (except, I would say LGB, not just LG). I think about this constantly. It may sound idealistic, but I would like to be able to present information about the struggle LGB people are facing in the most accurate and humanizing way I possibly can. Unfortunately, this seems to be one of the most universal burdens of being a tiny statistical minority: A lot of people in the larger groups are not going to understand you, and you have to use what little speaking time you have as carefully as you can if you want to effectively advocate for your group.

Bisexual allies can help, but as you can see the vast majority of them goes allong with the TQ+

Bisexual people are not just "allies," they are IN the LGB. It's LGB, not just LG-- LGB drop the T. You implied you're bisexual; I'm sorry if it feels like you are not included. Each group within the LGB has its own unique struggles and I think it can be easy for discussion to get heated over our differences in experience of the world, lol.

So I don't know how I feel about the spam of irrevelant weird stuffs on this sub (in my opinion).

Can you give some examples of what you're talking about? It looks like you've been here a little less than a month; I've been here a year and I've noticed that sometimes we have long runs of content that trends towards one particular topic or another, and I haven't been around as much the past few weeks so maybe I'm missing something obvious.

It's just a giant rant place, and some cries for help... I don't know if it's the point of this place

The point of this place is:

  • To find support from and take solace in the existence of other like-minded people. I get told "you should be ashamed for not liking dick," as a lesbian, practically ANYWHERE else on social media! This is one of the rare places where people acknowledge my sexual orientation is legitimate. Doesn't that seem valuable to you? Essentially, the message I get from people here is: "You are not alone." And it is relieving to know that I'm not alone.

  • To discuss the TQ+ as an ideological movement. Sometimes we do discussion threads on here, I like them a lot, and (when I'm around) I post news articles and other people do too.

A few people on here actively volunteer or are interested in activism, but mostly this is a discussion board-- and yes, actual discussion happens here if you look for it, and if you choose to participate it. :) I think my own logical thinking skills have been exercised almost constantly when I get into debates in this sub, to the point where I feel like it's improved other areas of my life offline, like my work.

[–]Daddiescummies 1 insightful - 2 fun1 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 2 fun -  (4 children)

. I also don't think the close alliance to gender critical/radical feminism is helpful, in term of being heard by the population or even taking responsability.

I agree with this 100%. I find most gender critical and radical feminist groups center the voices and needs of white women. Men and minorities are marginalized in these space, and they don't hold spaces for anyone who isn't a white woman.