HomophobiaPsychotically homophobic (against males) in aleatory Ovarit topic

submitted by jamescherry from ovarit.com

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[–][deleted] [score hidden] stickied comment (1 child)

This sub is named for LGB dropping the T. However, in order to prove why that's necessary, we also have to show what's happening to us as LGB people (including and regardless of TQ+).

LGB doesn't exist for the sole purpose of dropping the T. We're also demonstrating why and how LGB still need to fight for and represent ourselves.

This post is showing our users and outsiders that homophobia still exists, and it exists within groups that some consider allies.

We allow nuanced discussion about many topics which impact LGB, but we don't allow targeting and/or spewing hatred. If any users feel like something funky is going on, please use the "report" option to alert mods so we can take a look.

[–]RedEyedWarriorGay | Male | 🇮🇪 Irish 🇮🇪 | Antineoliberal | Cocks are Compulsory 19 insightful - 1 fun19 insightful - 0 fun20 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I am aware that some radical feminists hate gay men. But they don't hate us because we're gay; they hate us because we are men.

For the record, I don't care if somebody hates all men, or hates all women, or hates everyone from both sexes. Is it wrong to hate an entire class of people? Absolutely. But hate is a part of life, and it's inevitable that someone will hate you for a reason, whether it's justified, misguided or arbitrary.

I don't mind if people around me are radical feminists, moderate feminists, MRAs, MGTOWs, gender roles advocates or whatever. Just don't force me to act a certain way or hold a certain opinion. I just want to be left alone. And I want to drop the T, because TRAs won't leave gay and bisexual people alone.

I agree that surrogacy is a bad thing. Yes, it's mostly straight couples who exploit women and children through surrogacy, but there are a lot of LGBT activists, mostly gay men with neoliberal ideologies, who advocate for the legalisation of surrogacy. But a lot of gay men are against it, including myself. And we'd be the majority of gay men if most gay men saw what pregnancy entails. But I also hope that radfems recognise that a lot of women have benefitted from exploiting other women through surrogacy, so they need to self reflect a little bit, though a lot of them do thankfully.

[–]SerpensInferna 17 insightful - 2 fun17 insightful - 1 fun18 insightful - 2 fun -  (10 children)

Why are these posts being posted in DroptheT? What does it have to do with dropping the T?

[–]SilverWolf 15 insightful - 2 fun15 insightful - 1 fun16 insightful - 2 fun -  (7 children)

Not the OP, but clearly the radfems that some of us thought were allies are not in fact on our side, unless you're a man-hating lesbian. Radfems need to be dropped from feminism just like the T from LGB

[–]SerpensInferna 12 insightful - 3 fun12 insightful - 2 fun13 insightful - 3 fun -  (6 children)

Your comment makes no sense. It's hard for me not to see this as someone trying to intentionally stir up trouble and infighting.

This group is about dropping the T from the LGB. The vast majority of users on ovarit agree. Who cares if some of the people who post on that website have opinions you don't agree with? It doesn't mean every radical feminist feels the same way. It's highly suspicious to me that someone is going on that website and pulling dubiously claimed "misandrist" posts to place here on this sub.

[–][deleted] 6 insightful - 2 fun6 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 2 fun -  (4 children)

I mean infighting would assume we are on the same side. My logic is my enemy of my enemy is still in truth my enemy. Just because we hold for similar causes doesn't make you my friend. If rad fem ideology wasn't so inherently unpopular I would treat them the same as TRAs and they have just as many idiotic beliefs. I mean even their stances on what causes trans issues I firmly object to. They have a habit of ascribing every FTM as being just harmed by bad perceptions of her body whereas every man is just a fetish sex pest. Despite the fact many MTF are deeply misandristic or hate their bodies and that tons of FTM over idolize the sexual aspects of men and gay relationships. Plus honestly if you want these issues to be taken seriously by society the last thing you want it is to be stapled to is any rad fems. Extremists don't help your cause.

I agree it's not really related to the discussion of the sub but personally I don't know how common it is on here but ultimately while most women are wrongfully called TERFs for having issues with trans right activists I don't have any real sympathy for real TERFs. People who buy into radical feminist ideologies.

Confused by the dubiously claimed comment. It's pretty obvious there isn't really much to doubt there.

[–]SerpensInferna 13 insightful - 3 fun13 insightful - 2 fun14 insightful - 3 fun -  (2 children)

My argument is not about what radfems believe, I am questioning why there is a sudden influx of anti-ovarit sentiment here when it doesn't have anything to do with the purpose of this forum.

Ovarit users want to drop the T. We want to drop the T. Posting ovarit-hate here makes no sense unless there are ulterior motives.

[–][deleted] 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Fair

[–]reluctant_commenter 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Posting ovarit-hate

It's not "ovarit-hate," it's calling out homophobia.

[–]yousaythosethingsFind and Replace "gatekeeping" with "having boundaries" 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I agree. This is all irrelevant to LGBDropTheT. I have no interest in participating in Ovarit, which is why I’m here and not there. Radical feminism is an ideology that is separate and apart from being attracted to the same sex. Radical feminism tends to have a lot in common with gender identity ideology, both being rooted in critical theory, and adherence to neither is inherent to being LGB. At the same time, radical feminism is so aggressively alienating that it will never have the cultural impact as TQ. For some of us, radfemmery/Gender Critical were stops on our peaking journey because they are the face of being critical of gender identity ideology. But then we realized we were at odds with them too.

So yea we get it. But there isn’t a lot of radfemmery around these parts and these posts are off-topic for this sub. Can we move on now?

[–]xanditAGAB (Assigned Gay at Birth) 9 insightful - 2 fun9 insightful - 1 fun10 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

we post about about homophobia in general too.

[–]reluctant_commenter 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

It's a post about homophobia. This is an LGB sub, not just a DropTheT sub. And homophobia is generally relevant to a sub about being LGB.

I think posts like this are relevant, at least until s/LGB is opened and they can be posted there.

If we wouldn't put up with this type of homophobic crap from TRAs, why should we put up with it from any other ideology/faction? (Including conservatives and religious people.)

[–]stunaep 11 insightful - 2 fun11 insightful - 1 fun12 insightful - 2 fun -  (4 children)

This is really over-the-top.

It's actually been a long thought of fantasy from Gay male rights activism that babies would be bred in labs and only boys allowed

You mean... like the exact fantasy radfems have of getting rid of all males and growing girls in a lab? Except the difference is that I have never seen this in gay rights activism before because it's not a tenet---it's a joke---whereas for radfems this is a serious goal.

There is a reason why the harshest critic of gay men that are Republican yet also want to stomp on women's rights exist...and that is because he is still wearing his mask. ;)

It's a common theme for straight people in general to call very evil heterosexual men "secretly gay". It's common on that website too. They often imply that there is something "gay" about heterosexual men mistreating women. "If you were really straight enough to love me, you'd treat me well, but you're not so you must not be straight" is the gist. "You respect your heterosexual male friends more than me so you must be gay." Sacred heterosexuality is presented as the ideal, and any failure of the heterosexual male is deemed homosexuality. Homosexuality is treated as a flaw within otherwise normal heterosexual males.

These are immutable biological traits being treated as character flaws. Notice the parallels between the heterosexual female-supremacist and TRA (who, surprise, are mostly heterosexual) rhetoric. It's cut and dry homophobia. We're caught in the middle of a shit-flinging contest between heterosexual males and females and somehow in the end they try to make it our fault.

Neither of these groups (radfems or TRAs) are on our side. We need to focus on getting OUR voices heard instead of uplifting radical feminists. The situation where Karen Davis's followers bullied Arty Morty was a travesty, but we can't let them silence us. Yes, radfems don't support the T. But not for the same reasons as us. They're conservative and homophobic and are not our allies. They ally with traditional religious conservative homophobes and spout mirrored rhetoric. And they're heterosexuals so their numbers are much greater than ours. But actual resistance, resistance that's going to be able to gain traction and actually push back against transsexualism, has to come from us.

[–]dilsencySame-sex community 9 insightful - 1 fun9 insightful - 0 fun10 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

There is a reason why the harshest critic of gay men that are Republican yet also want to stomp on women's rights exist... and that is because he is still wearing his mask. ;)

It's a common theme for straight people in general to call very evil heterosexual men "secretly gay".

I've seen it too, and I hate it. People calling homophobic politicians like Mike Pence secretly gay. It feels like pushing the blame of homophobia onto gay people.

[–]reluctant_commenter 6 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 0 fun7 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I agree, although unfortunately I've talked to LGB people in real life who insist on this, too. Sure it's sometimes a thing... but only for a minority of homophobic people. It's not always self-hating "projection" going on, sometimes it's just hatred of others.

[–]RedEyedWarriorGay | Male | 🇮🇪 Irish 🇮🇪 | Antineoliberal | Cocks are Compulsory 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

That bothers me as well. Do you think gag men would be homophobic if society wasn't homophobic?

[–]yousaythosethingsFind and Replace "gatekeeping" with "having boundaries" 6 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 0 fun7 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

This place overwhelmingly doesn’t uplift radical feminism.

[–]hellonumpty 9 insightful - 1 fun9 insightful - 0 fun10 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

YES your gay male friend who doesn't have your back is just another man playing a part in a sinister plot that is awful to women, awful to children, awful to families, filled with hypocrisy, filled with gaslighting, filled with lies, filled with sexism.

OK, well I hope they know that this goes for their spouses too then. 🤷🏻‍♀️✌🏻

[–]xanditAGAB (Assigned Gay at Birth) 9 insightful - 12 fun9 insightful - 11 fun10 insightful - 12 fun -  (0 children)

OK, well I hope they know that this goes for their spouses too then

No spouses. To reproduce, radfems who reach the highest, most purest level of man-free feminism instantly split in two like an amoeba

[–]SilverWolf 8 insightful - 2 fun8 insightful - 1 fun9 insightful - 2 fun -  (1 child)

Wow if you look back to what that moron was replying to, there is an article that actually says the "pregnant or birthing person" could be transitioning from male to female. As in ACTUAL pregnant men (not FtM). And here I thought the link in this post would be the dumbest thing i'd read today

[–]xanditAGAB (Assigned Gay at Birth) 4 insightful - 2 fun4 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

yeah it had nothing to do with the article, which was about some training manual that got trolled or something. She took it like it was serious future science.

[–]jamescherry[S] 6 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 0 fun7 insightful - 1 fun -  (6 children)

According to that person, which I think it's a woman, male homosexuality has never been linked to misogyny. She* implies that everyone of us is an abuser, gaslighter, pedophile, pornsick, TRA, lesbophobe, admirer of Ancient Greek pederasty, and groomer. She* launches every detail in a long rant that ends with conflation of male homosexuality with misogyny, something she* wrote it doesn't happen.

Why are there so many radfems mad at us? What's happening?

[–]xanditAGAB (Assigned Gay at Birth) 9 insightful - 1 fun9 insightful - 0 fun10 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I think she's just an old school homophobe. She accuses gay men of alot of things libfems are doing.

[–]ChunkeeguyTeam T*RF Fuck Yeah 8 insightful - 1 fun8 insightful - 0 fun9 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

I think it's just a general rage at society. To be honest I don't blame them sometimes. I'm in no doubt that I grew up with a level of privilege and freedom even as a gay man due to my biology and societal attitudes that no woman can ever really enjoy.

[–]IridescentAnacondastrictly dickly 6 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 0 fun7 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Why are there so many radfems mad at us? What's happening?

They just hate men, that's all. Always have, always will.

[–]reluctant_commenter 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Why are there so many radfems mad at us? What's happening?

It looks like you're pretty new to Saidit; are you not well acquainted with radical feminist beliefs? There's a sizeable chunk of radical feminists who are very anti-homosexuality and/or anti-bisexuality. If you're curious about it, I can link some reading materials.

There have been one or two posts I've seen on this sub that've gotten swarmed by radfems, but those were both well over a year ago. Fortunately, many people on this sub recognize the more toxic elements of the ideology.

[–]ElectraHeart 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

If I had a penny for every time a homophobe radfem grasped the thinnest straws to put dirt on gay men, i'd be very rich. Here's the disclaimer for the manifesto:

"In 1987, Michael Swift was asked to contribute an editorial piece to GCN, an important gay community magazine, although well to the left of most American gay and lesbian opinion. A decade later this text, printed in the Congressional Record is repeatedly cited, apparently verbatim, by the religious right as evidence of the "Gay Agenda". The video Gay Rights, Special Rights, put out by Lou Sheldon's Traditional Values Coalition cites it with ominous music and picture of children. But when the religious rights cites this text, they always omit, as does the Congressional record, the vital first line, which sets the context for the piece. In other words, every other version of this found on the net is part of the radical right's great lie about gay people.

This essay is an outré, madness, a tragic, cruel fantasy, an eruption of inner rage, on how the oppressed desperately dream of being the oppressor."