all 25 comments

[–]Sapphicatalyst 16 insightful - 1 fun16 insightful - 0 fun17 insightful - 1 fun -  (5 children)

I'm a small artist and sell GC/LGB themed designs on the side in accounts separate from my main art account. This way I won't get ruined in a ban. I just try to ignore the LGBTQZJLMAJG+ nonsense. I've received rude comments, but I've also received several private messages from people saying, "Hey, I can't be out about being GC, but I just wanted to let you know you have my support!" It makes me wonder how many GC/LGB artists are actually out there just keeping a low profile out of fear of banishment. Several "Terfy" artists I've followed have experienced bans already, and it's demoralizing trying to contribute to a community that's constantly under attack. I also bet a lot of it has to do with money as well. You can make a lot during May-June catering to the rainbow crowd.

Anyway, sorry about your situation. I don't do fan art, but am well aware of how insanely "queer" those spaces are. I hope this trend fades soon and those kids move onto the next (and hopefully less damaging) big thing.

[–]juoreally tired woman[S] 8 insightful - 1 fun8 insightful - 0 fun9 insightful - 1 fun -  (4 children)

I had similar messages on my other account. But frankly, that didn't make me happy, I wanted public support, to show them that yeah... A lot of people actually agree with me. We're not mean or trying to hurt others, you're just delusional or mentaly ill or both, which is fine. Just don't take it out on us for telling the truth. But yeah, there's no magical answer. It's all about hiding, or being destroyed.

Your insight was interesting tho. I don't know if a lot of artists feel that way with all the pronouns in bio and shit that I see. The most popular ones in the fandoms are always on board with that crap (they are also professionals in the industry for the majority of them (working for games, animation, movies etc), they just create fun art accounts to share their interests), and I partially blame them too because art have always been vehiculing a lot of ideas or political movements. They're not innocent and are playing a huge role in this battle, just like the medias. And putting up with this shit daily is exhausting. It's like being at the core of the problem all the time.

Thank you for your message, and for creating things that cheer peoples up. Please keep creating, that's really important. It means a lot in this world, even if a lot of people are unable to recognize that. Take care.

[–]INeedSomeTimeAsexual Ally 9 insightful - 1 fun9 insightful - 0 fun10 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

Truth be told you never know how many people with pronouns in bio also secretly don’t believe in this crap but they just wanna cynically protect themselves from that. We all are in a weird circus, where I guess the social ostracism scares us all. We were taught and programmed that for daring to question any part of dogma we will face punishment. It works both ways. It also teaches the other people to harass you for what they find unacceptable. It's very sick but I don’t have enough of mental health to deal with it so I am sadly closeted about it. Insane how trans people are legitimately a protected class. You can’t critize them. You can't form questions about stuff related to them. It's so anti-science not to explore this subject. So many well established theories were debunked despite being seen as the truth for many years. People worship trans ideas as some truth absolute. It's not trans activism isn’t based on science. It's based on beliefs, which use studies activists even misinterpret to fit their agenda.

[–]juoreally tired woman[S] 10 insightful - 1 fun10 insightful - 0 fun11 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

It isn't just the pronouns, it's the "they/them" non-sense, it's sharing trans posts, drawing the flag, creating non-binary characters and so on. There's a difference between being passive about something and actively encouraging it. A lot of artists are reinforcing the idea that this is the right way to do things, that this is the right side of history and are telling their followers that this is right by normalizing this shit. Same for streamers and so on, people that talks to young people, hiding behind the "fun" facade.

But sure there's also a lot of people only playing along but this isn't innocent, it's harmful to lie in the long run. This just isn't okay. People's life get ruined and speaking up isn't an act of bravery but common sense, we're not in robin hood... And it doesn't make sense that we all know this is wrong and say nothing. It's ridiculous. We are being manipulated, collectively, and we're cowards. That's what we are. That's so sad but true. Because we have responsabilities and obligations, we are cowards.

[–]Sapphicatalyst 6 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 0 fun7 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

Are a lot of the artists encouraging and engaging in TQ+ art straight? That would make sense, because they have nothing to lose, but gain a lot of followers in the current zeitgeist.

Considering how easy it is for GC artists to get banned on any major platform that allows you to get a following, what do you think would be a good move for artists to make, who want to make a change, but have careers to lose? Personally, I originally just stuck to very pro-LGB designs, and only recently dipped a toe in GC stuff. For context, here's my Redbubble side shop I was referring to. I'm not good or popular enough to get attacked, but it is very frustrating to be drowning in a sea of "Fuck Terfs" and "Die Cis Scum" when I just want to celebrate fucking same-sex attraction that I/we were fucking bullied and shamed over for decades. I fucking hate having to walk on eggshells again, out of fear of losing yet another and another and another space to share and collaborate on LGB art. (Anger not at you. Just angry, tired, and tipsy. Thanks for bringing the art topic up!)

[–]Kai_Decadence 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

From what I've observed, a lot of them are definitely straight but call themselves "queer". I've said it before and I'll keep saying it but I haven't met much of any fellow gays or lesbians who call themselves "queer", it's usually bisexual and/or straight women who do this and of course they would, they aren't completely same sex attracted so they won't fully understand why many gays and lesbians don't use that word to describe ourselves.

[–]JulienMayfair 10 insightful - 2 fun10 insightful - 1 fun11 insightful - 2 fun -  (3 children)

It's not just the visual arts. A friend of mine teaches in an acting program in California, and he tells me that fully 50% of his students are now some variety of trans or neo-gender.

[–]juoreally tired woman[S] 8 insightful - 1 fun8 insightful - 0 fun9 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

Great... Yeah they pretty much took over the entertainment world as a whole. It's a shame.

Edit : Forgot to ask you how your friend is dealing with that ? Did he just accepts it and move on with his day ?

[–]JulienMayfair 8 insightful - 1 fun8 insightful - 0 fun9 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

To keep his job, he just accepts it. Could you imagine what would happen if he registered an objection?

[–]Kai_Decadence 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

The alternative scene has been swept up by this bullshit as well. When I got on blast for being a "tErF" because I supported Maya Forstaters, JK Rowling, and Magdalen Berns, I got banned from the active goth groups I used to active in and now whenever I even try to interact with a goth or just an alternative looking person in general, if they're aware of my YT channel, they avoid me at most and/or will say how awful I am for being "tRaNsPhObIc".

I used to be excited to see alternative people out in society but now that excitement is gone and I try to avoid them lol...

[–]lunarstrain 9 insightful - 1 fun9 insightful - 0 fun10 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

This is a tough one. The way I personally chose to handle it is to go cold turkey with social media, I've been relatively happy with the results but I know this isn't the right choice for everyone. I just couldn't handle how grating it was, interacting with all of those TQ+ people.

There is a middle path, but you'll still have to sacrifice your relationships. You distance yourself from those other artists and turn off all notifications, keeping the people of the internet at arm's length. You'll still benefit from having a place to share your art and using these people to further your career. I don't know if I'd recommend it but I feel it's worth mentioning.

Sorry I can't be more helpful, I hope you have good luck no matter what decision you make.

[–]juoreally tired woman[S] 6 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 0 fun7 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I've been doing that but that's rough. Also you can't shut down people too much in fandoms because the whole part that makes it fun is the sharing and interactions. That's why I wanted things to change. But I don't really have lot of options that doesn't include burning down a part of something on my part.

Thank you for commenting regardless, and thank you for the encouragement !

[–]Kai_Decadence 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I just couldn't handle how grating it was, interacting with all of those TQ+ people.

This is really pushing me as well. I try to ignore it all but what's really getting to me is when I'm seeing younger artists in their teens and early 20s saying how they want to have "top surgery" and how they're "non-binary" or "transmen" and it's getting to a point where I can't ignore it. These youths don't understand that "top surgery" is gonna be something they regret (especially when they develop phantom nipple pain). And the way some older TRA artists are blindly encouraging this stuff makes it even more horrifying and all the more reason why I want to come and speak out against this because the common thing you here from those who do "detransition" is that they wished someone would've not affirmed them and was brutally honest about what they were risking instead of blindly affirming them.

[–]Horror-SwordfishI don't get how flairs work 7 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 0 fun8 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

Are you making art for fun or are you trying to make a living off of it? If you're trying to make a living off of it through online commissions or something, you might just be stuck. But that doesn't mean you need to change your art for anyone; just try and not let the weird shit get to you and seek out people in the community that feel the way you do so you know you have friends there.

If you're just making it for fun and posting it online, I'd say either (a) stop posting and just make your art for fun; show it off to people in your life or on private social media accounts for just your friends and family, or (b) try to find some private groups for art enthusiasts and take the temp of the group before you start posting; you'll be able to tell pretty quickly if they've gone all in on the TQ stuff.

As a writer, I unfortunately tend to avoid LGB relationships or characters in my writing because I feel like it's just going to look like virtue signaling. Sometimes I write LGB characters, because that's my experience and I want to be able to reflect my life experience in my writing, but as artists we may just have to ride out this weird wave.

[–]juoreally tired woman[S] 6 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 0 fun7 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I do both... And I know they try to ruin people's career all the time because of this shit but at some point I am asking myself... Is it really worth it. Is my career worth me shutting the fuck up over what I truly believe in. Is having a shitty job where I can say what I think worst than telling the truth when I can about something that matters to me. It's not like I'm trying to impose weird shit on people. It's just basic biology, basic acceptance (wear what you want, go and be GNC) and that being same-sex attracted isn't a joke. My choice are really reduced to "shutting the fuck up" or working in a supermarket/fast food compagny ? Or what, making my whole life about politics ? Not to be a selfish asshole but I don't particulary feel like being anybody's hero. I just can't lie that much and pretend I am okay with it. I am not, it's affecting me. And I worked hard on my skills. I also worked on my behavior to be more friendly to people a whole lot. And all my efforts seem like going into a pit of nothingness because I can't really find allies except if I out myself as gender critical or whatever.

Speaking of gender critical... It's so funny to me that radical feminists talk so bad about trans women when, well, from my personal experience, women made my life a living hell because the spaces dedicated to us is full of this stupid ideology with or whitout the men around. They worship men bullshit no matter what while crying about patriarchy (How many "lesbian" artists I saw drawing dicks on their female characters, while gay men are well focused on male anatomy, whitout bothering about trans men ? So many time. Good for gay men tho I wouldn't want it to be different, but I am very disappointed by women who do absolutely gorgeous art only to ruin it for dumb politics). It bothers me more than a dude saying he's a chick somehow. Anyway, I'll figure something out (or probably will just do nothing).

Sorry I tend to think while writing so I wrote too much. Thank you for your insight regardless of my rambling.

[–]Kai_Decadence 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

seek out people in the community that feel the way you do so you know you have friends there.

But that's the hard part, finding artists in these fandom/spaces that don't believe in TQ+ If we're all hiding, how do we find each other?

[–]Shock_Waver 7 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 0 fun8 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

It's weird how all of the same artists online share the same beliefs? I thought I was the only one who noticed the correlation between the eternally online TQ+ crowd and animation and art.

I feel you shouldn't be scared to expess yourself, because it seems as if though the mob is trying to silence and cancel you for "thinking incorrectly". Sometimes it's just you against the world.

[–]juoreally tired woman[S] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

No you're not the only one. This ideology is been sold to the kids to "fix" the damage previously created by rigids man/woman representations. Like instead of reinforcing the idea that your body isn't your enemy and that you can present yourself in many ways as a boy or a girl, we've been over-sold the same representation as being the right thing (what kids now call "cis" which is just being gender comforming and that make a lot of them unhappy (which is completely normal)). I sort of blame artists, but also not really because... Well, "money never lie" (if people will buy a product with women with big boobs, they'll make more products with women with big boobs. Moral doesn't count in the business world). And not to say that people usually don't have much respect for creative people, but they really don't so why would they side with the "common sense side" when this very side wants them to find a "real job" to begin with.

So the industry gives what people want ("want" = what works) so they won't collapse and artists needs their jobs so they follow the rules. That still don't fully excuse them, it's still shaking the wrong hands for their own personal benefits. Nothing unusual tho, and artists aren't the only one doing that.

Then... There's the ones I call the worst... They're the ones that are truly over doing it with their TQ+ propaganda art on top of making those work places insufferable because of their identity obsession. I have no respect for those people that are actively hurting people by feeding them lies... And even if they're in pain too, I just see it as "Misery loves company".

There's a lot of compromises in the modern society to make to fix this whole issue... And art/visuals/medias play a big part in this. It's just less apparent or people do not take it seriously enough yet.

[–]NinniNicotine 6 insightful - 2 fun6 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 2 fun -  (1 child)

Oh my gosh, are you me? Because this is something I could have written, I feel exactly the same way! I draw mostly fanart too and I feel so lonely in fandom spaces. I once counted that about 75-80% of people who follow my art account are some flavor of TQ+ or at least have pronouns in their bio and it made me so sad. I haven't been posting my art online for awhile now because I feel so unmotivated and I don't know if I should just quit completely. Sometimes I think I should keep posting because I know there's other people out there who are just as tired of this bullshit as I am and maybe they'd like to see something different... but it's just so tiring to feel that you're completely alone and only people who interact with you are the people that'd try to cancel you if they knew what you really think.

So, I really don't have any advice to give you because I'm in the same place... Just wanted to say I feel you.

[–]INeedSomeTimeAsexual Ally 5 insightful - 2 fun5 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

I feel this. I don’t wanna be surrounded by people who would shred me to pieces if they found out what I truly think.

[–]INeedSomeTimeAsexual Ally 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

I feel you but I cannot reveal more details about myself why. But I also hang in similar spaces and thoughts close to yours occur to me. I hang out with a small circle of people, who are still on board with the ideology, one recently realized "they" are not "cis" but seemigly they still use pronouns matching their sex (besides for "they" being listed too) so no clue what's the deal here (I know that they aren't attention seeking person also -btw I used "they" to actually make sure of my anonymity) but I am actually relieved that apparently they don't really go transition route because that was my biggest fear and it pained me I couldn't really voice it without being seen as a potential transphobe (even if there is just so many red flags implying that their new identity comes from being a simply awkward person feeling unsafe).

The topic doesn't happen really often so it's tolerable - I don't feel like an impostor too often. I don't find it worth it to break a friendship of many years just because of this issue since the topic isn't constantly brought up. Also I think these people would be severely heartbroken and I know one person isn't in the best headspace right now... seriously. I am afraid what they'd do if they found it out. I am serious here.

I feel you on so many levels. There was many times (after my friend's come out moment - because I feared they'd go medical transition route what I would be unable to stomach) when I wanted to suddenly delete all my social media, come back under some new name. Well, I didn't do this for reasons I mentioned before. I hope that with time there will be more and more info popping out, which should make these people question the ideology itself finally.

[–]juoreally tired woman[S] 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

We've been waiting for years for it to pass tho so I hope you're very very patient. I'll be in my 50's ? 60's ? Before these idiots actually figure out something simple, basic, primary that is backed up by a lot of good people that make sense. I mean Jesus Christ look at us... Hiding in the shadow, scared to speak our truth, when we have truly done nothing wrong. This is just sad. I don't even feel better to know people are in a similar situation. I just want it to get better for all of us.

[–]Aurelius 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

That's great you do art don't mind the TQ+++ crowd. I like to draw a bit too but I never really posted much except a bit on deviant art which has gone downhill.

Don't give up, in sure there are many LGB who love your art!

[–]juoreally tired woman[S] 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

You should post it, it's (sometimes) fun to have engagement

I hope so, really, because that's the only thing that would makes it worthwhile ! That and persuading people that having a female/male body doesn't mean you have to present in any specific way.

Thank you for your comment and encouragement !

[–]Kai_Decadence 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I know this is a late post but as a fellow artist, I just had to comment and say that I totally understand your frustration because I'm getting so fed up and irritated by how much the TQ+ has dominated the art social media scene. I will say that I have made conscious effort to not bother interacting with any artist I come across on Twitter who lists pronouns or is a TRA (you can tell by the things they retweet) which has made trying to make friends in the scene borderline impossible. When I came out in support for Maya Forstater and JK Rowling back in 2020 on my Facebook, I lost all my friends and I got banned from groups I used to be very active so believe me, I totally feel why you are hesitant to come out and speak against trans/gender ideology because it really will more than likely cause your friends to abandon you. The worst are the ones who say thay they can respect your beliefs but slowly stop communicating with you until they cease contact altogether... That happened with 3 acquaintances I had and it sucked to go through.

I'm not fully out with my beliefs on my art twitter but I leave no room for people to think I support trans ideology, I don't make "trans" characters or art and I don't use neopronouns neither. Some artists I follow whose work I do like do have trans-identifying characters and I just bite my tongue even though many of their characters' backstories showcase how nonsensical the ideology is (lol). I'm still debating if I want to go public with being gender critical (I call it "pro-reality") on my art twitter if all else to be an example of an artist who is not a "cOnSeRvAtIvE" and is a gender nonconforming, feminine presenting gay man who doesn't believe in trans ideology but part of me is afraid of being completely burned at the stake with no chance to ever make new art friends ever again. I'm not gonna lie, I have more or less been on my own with not much social interaction at all after 2020 when all my friends abandoned me and I got banned from some of the groups and because of how the TQ+ ideology has captured most of the art world, it's made me fearful to even try to make new friends for fear of being rejected and called a "bigot" or "transphobe" when I know deep down that I'm not those things and that most of the time these people don't even see how toxic the ideology really is. And I especially feel you on not supporting things like women getting their healthy breasts amputated or getting frankenphalluses ("Phalloplasty") sewn onto their vagina that will lead to all kinds of health disasters like developing sepsis because of the fistulas... I follow this one artist who is in my age bracket (30s) and is a blind TRA and is supporting two younger artist women who have barely entered their 20s and goes along with them wanting to get "top surgery". I want to step in and say something but I don't because of the inevitable backlash I know I'll get... And then having to hear artists saying things like "AFAB / AMAB people", "people with vaginas", and just all that other bullshit that just really aggravates the hell out of me.

Ultimately the choice is up to you. Which ever way you ended up going, it's totally understandable. Personally part of me thinks you should go public just to show that you don't have to swallow TQ+ dogma to be an artist and that you're not some evil "transphobe". That we are regular people just living in reality and that way , you could be an example to other artists who may not believe in this gender crap and maybe find some confident to speak out as well. But agian, there's no denying that it can also lead to burned friendships... It's all about what you think you can handle. When I came out on my YouTube channel, I faced a lot of rejection but I also got quite a bit of support as well and as soon as I finish up my follow up video explaining why I don't believe in TQ+, I may try to search out and find other people who feel the same way.